WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM

Film Zulu Dawn:General Lord Chelmsford: For a savage, as for a child, chastisement is sometimes a kindness. Sir Henry Bartle Frere: Let us hope, General, that this will be the final solution to the Zulu problem.
 
HomeHome  GalleryGallery  Latest imagesLatest images  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  
Latest topics
» Punch's view of Chelmsford's tactics!
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyToday at 11:37 am by lydenburg

» Writing advice
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Mar 26, 2024 2:26 pm by Julian Whybra

» Private John Scott 24th Regiment a fugitive at large
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyWed Mar 20, 2024 12:53 pm by Dash

» Sergeant W E Warren RA - Veteran
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Mar 19, 2024 9:32 pm by Matthew Turl

» Your favourite line from Zulu or Zulu Dawn
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Mar 19, 2024 4:52 pm by Julian Whybra

» 100,000 posts!
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Mar 19, 2024 2:20 pm by Julian Whybra

» Zulu Dawn/Zulu - New Immortals Film The Way Forward ?
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySat Mar 16, 2024 2:34 pm by jgregory

» Badge on 2/60th and 3/60th foreign service helmets
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySat Mar 16, 2024 11:05 am by John Young

» Corporal James Frowen Williams F Company.
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Mar 15, 2024 9:08 am by Julian Whybra

» British rations and morale
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Mar 11, 2024 11:05 pm by Julian Whybra

» Blue Plaque to James Egan, alias Private Hagan
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Mar 11, 2024 9:16 pm by ADMIN

» A few questions regarding Rorke's Drift and Isandlwana
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyWed Mar 06, 2024 9:16 pm by Julian Whybra

» William J Hoare 24th Regiment??
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Mar 03, 2024 7:08 pm by Dash

» Swinburn Carbine issue in AZW
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 29, 2024 12:53 pm by Rob D

» Australians who went to Zululand and fought in the 1879 war.
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 29, 2024 8:39 am by John Young

» Philip Price
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 29, 2024 7:55 am by Julian Whybra

» Alfred Fairlie Henderson
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 29, 2024 7:47 am by RoryReynolds

» August Hammar Letter Dated 6th Jan 1879
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 22, 2024 8:34 pm by Stefaan

» Bearing The Cross by Ken Blakeson | BBC RADIO DRAMA: Ken Blakeson's play tells the story of the Battle of Rorke's Drift and the effect it had on three of the soldiers who fought in it.
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyWed Feb 21, 2024 10:57 am by Julian Whybra

» Letter of officer during Zulu wars.
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyWed Feb 21, 2024 10:47 am by Julian Whybra

» About the second invasion
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Feb 20, 2024 9:14 pm by 90th

» Zulu Festival Brecon July 2024
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySat Feb 17, 2024 7:35 pm by John Young

» Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Feb 16, 2024 8:26 am by Julian Whybra

» Private J. McCrudden 1/13 Foot
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Feb 11, 2024 3:10 am by 90th

» Death of Michael Jayson (Zulu Dawn)
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 08, 2024 9:55 pm by ADMIN

» The anniversary of 22nd January in 2024
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 08, 2024 3:51 pm by luke1997

» What was the distance?
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 08, 2024 8:46 am by Stefaan

» Mrs Henry Hook
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Feb 06, 2024 3:14 pm by Kenny

» "With 6 good riflemen"
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Feb 05, 2024 2:30 pm by Mr M. Cooper

» What was G company supposed to do?
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Feb 04, 2024 9:31 pm by Julian Whybra

» Private 1445 Charles Meates 17th Lancers and his brother William Wylie
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Feb 02, 2024 10:07 pm by John Young

» South Africa Medal With Clasp To Pvt J. Salter 3/60th
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Feb 02, 2024 3:12 pm by Foody

» Weatherleys Border Horse Flag
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 01, 2024 9:40 pm by Herbie

» Edward Plantagenet Kemeys-Tynte
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Jan 23, 2024 10:06 pm by Edjg

» How many started?
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Jan 23, 2024 10:10 am by Julian Whybra

Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
March 2024
MonTueWedThuFriSatSun
    123
45678910
11121314151617
18192021222324
25262728293031
CalendarCalendar
Most active topics
Durnford was he capable.1
Durnford was he capable. 4
Durnford was he capable.5
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Isandlwana, Last Stands
The ammunition question
Durnford was he capable. 3
Durnford was he capable.2
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Most Viewed Topics
Please Do Not Post Ads on Our Forum
Google Chrome new standards imposed
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Recent Members To The ZULU WAR 1879 Discussion & Reference Forum ( A Small Victorian War in 1879)
The missing five hours.
ISANDLWANA SURVIVIORS
The ammunition question
Lieutenant Adendorff 1-3 N.N.C.
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Top posting users this month
Julian Whybra
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
Dash
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
Hobbes
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
SRB1965
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
Bill8183
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
ADMIN
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
jgregory
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
John Young
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
Tim Needham
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
1879graves
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_leftpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Barpvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Bar_right 
New topics
» Punch's view of Chelmsford's tactics!
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyToday at 11:37 am by lydenburg

» Writing advice
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Mar 19, 2024 8:57 pm by Hobbes

» 100,000 posts!
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Mar 17, 2024 11:14 am by ADMIN

» Badge on 2/60th and 3/60th foreign service helmets
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Mar 15, 2024 8:27 pm by Rob Herrick

» British rations and morale
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyWed Mar 06, 2024 9:24 pm by Hobbes

» Alfred Fairlie Henderson
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Feb 29, 2024 7:47 am by RoryReynolds

» Australians who went to Zululand and fought in the 1879 war.
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Feb 23, 2024 2:23 am by peterfarrell

» About the second invasion
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySat Feb 17, 2024 9:53 pm by Hobbes

» Zulu Festival Brecon July 2024
pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySat Feb 17, 2024 7:35 pm by John Young

Zero tolerance to harassment and bullying.
Due to recent events on this forum, we have now imposed a zero tolerance to harassment and bullying. All reports will be treated seriously, and will lead to a permanent ban of both membership and IP address. Any member blatantly corresponding in a deliberate and provoking manner will be removed from the forum as quickly as possible after the event.  If any members are being harassed behind the scenes PM facility by any member/s here at 1879zuluwar.com please do not hesitate to forward the offending text.  We are all here to communicate and enjoy the various discussions and information on the Anglo Zulu War of 1879. Opinions will vary, you will agree and disagree with one another, we will have debates, and so it goes. There is no excuse for harassment or bullying of anyone by another person on this site. The above applies to the main frame areas of the forum. The ring which is the last section on the forum, is available to those members who wish to partake in slagging matches. That section cannot be viewed by guests and only viewed by members that wish to do so. 
Fair Use Notice
Fair use notice. This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner. We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website. If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution.
 

 pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.

Go down 
+6
old historian2
Neil Aspinshaw
garywilson1
1879graves
John
90th
10 posters
AuthorMessage
90th

90th


Posts : 10881
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 67
Location : Melbourne, Australia

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Oct 15, 2009 1:26 pm

hi all
Thought you may find this interesting.

http://www.historikorders.com/zulu.html
cheers 90th.
Back to top Go down
John

John


Posts : 2558
Join date : 2009-04-06
Age : 61
Location : UK

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Oct 15, 2009 2:08 pm

90th thanks for the link. Lots of infoe:
Back to top Go down
1879graves

1879graves


Posts : 3361
Join date : 2009-03-03
Location : Devon

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Oct 15, 2009 8:30 pm

Nice one 90th, as John says loads of information :)
Back to top Go down
http://zuluwar1879.tribalpages.com
1879graves

1879graves


Posts : 3361
Join date : 2009-03-03
Location : Devon

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyThu Oct 15, 2009 9:00 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
ZULU MEDAL NAMED TO: 1857. PTE. J. HIND. 1/24th. FOOT.
Back to top Go down
http://zuluwar1879.tribalpages.com
garywilson1

garywilson1


Posts : 374
Join date : 2009-01-22
Age : 61
Location : Timisoara , Romania

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Oct 16, 2009 7:22 am

Very nice site , very nice prices ! anyone buying ? I suppose in time they will only increase in value .
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10881
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 67
Location : Melbourne, Australia

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: J. Hind K.I.A. ISANDLWANA   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Oct 16, 2009 8:48 am

Hi gary.
Yes, the medals are very expensive on this site , as you may know , you can pick them up
cheaper on other dealer sites on the net.
cheers 90th.
Back to top Go down
Neil Aspinshaw

Neil Aspinshaw


Posts : 553
Join date : 2009-10-14
Location : Loughborough

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Oct 18, 2009 9:33 pm

$9995, thats about £7000 not bad, expect around £8K nowadays
Here's my Isandlwana KIA, 883 J Kempster 1/24th.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Back to top Go down
http://www.martinihenry.org
old historian2

old historian2


Posts : 1093
Join date : 2009-01-14
Location : East London

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Oct 18, 2009 9:38 pm

Neil when you say here's my. Does that mean you actually have it.
Back to top Go down
ADMIN

ADMIN


Posts : 4349
Join date : 2008-11-01
Age : 64
Location : KENT

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Oct 18, 2009 9:46 pm

Neil. 883 J Kempster 1/24th. Is he related in anyway.
Back to top Go down
https://www.1879zuluwar.com
garywilson1

garywilson1


Posts : 374
Join date : 2009-01-22
Age : 61
Location : Timisoara , Romania

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Oct 19, 2009 6:38 am

if a KIA for a private soldier is GBP 7000 , how much does an officer's medal bring ? Do then come onto the market , and are the whereabouts of the medals of Pulleine and the company commanders known ?

also the survivors - do we know who has those medals ?

just interested - way out of my budget .
Back to top Go down
littlehand

littlehand


Posts : 7076
Join date : 2009-04-24
Age : 55
Location : Down South.

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Oct 19, 2009 8:23 am

I expect double the price for an officers medal. But what did happen to those medals of who was KIA. At Isandlwana.
Good question Gary.
Back to top Go down
Neil Aspinshaw

Neil Aspinshaw


Posts : 553
Join date : 2009-10-14
Location : Loughborough

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Oct 19, 2009 9:11 am

Old historian 2
Yes, had to talk to the wife nicely.

I have also the medal to Cooper 2/24th, promoted to Corporal at Rorkes Drift 23.2.1879.
He left Isandlwana morning with Chelsmford, presumably he was moved to make up the numbers of Pope's company.
Back to top Go down
http://www.martinihenry.org
90th

90th


Posts : 10881
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 67
Location : Melbourne, Australia

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: medals of those KIA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Oct 19, 2009 12:52 pm

Hi littlehand.
From what I can gather the next of kin picked up the effects , so I assume the medals would have been picked up
the same way. Over the years many were lost or sold to pawn shops to make some extra money when families were
struggling. Others may never have been picked up. The medals that werent claimed were sent back to the mint and
melted back down basically straight away. Others were donated back to the recipients regiment .
cheers 90th.
Back to top Go down
garywilson1

garywilson1


Posts : 374
Join date : 2009-01-22
Age : 61
Location : Timisoara , Romania

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Oct 19, 2009 1:14 pm

So does anyone have any idea how many are in circulation , including the more "famous" ones ?
Back to top Go down
Mr Greaves

Mr Greaves


Posts : 747
Join date : 2009-10-18

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Oct 19, 2009 7:27 pm

Another good question Gary. It will give us all something to research. I have read that the medals of those KIA at Isandlwana are sought after. So well done Neil.
Back to top Go down
old historian2

old historian2


Posts : 1093
Join date : 2009-01-14
Location : East London

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyMon Oct 19, 2009 10:18 pm

No campaign medal was instituted exclusively for the Zulu War. Bloody and hard-fought as it was, the War was no doubt regarded in Britain as but a part of the general fighting that took place from 1877 to 1879 between the various African tribes in Southern Africa and their British and Colonial overlords.

In 1854 royal sanction had been given for the award of a medal to the survivors of British regular troops who had served in any one of the three campaigns of 1835-36, 1846-47, or 1850-53, on the Eastern Frontier of the Cape Province.

Designed by William and L.C. Wyon, this medal bears on the obverse a beautiful portrayal of Victoria as the young queen, wearing a coronet. The reverse shows a lion, half-crouching watchfully, behind a protea bush, with the date '1853' in the exergue.

In 1880 it was ordained that the same medal should he awarded to all personnel - Colonial volunteers and native levies as well as British regulars - who had served in any of the campaigns in South Africa between September 1877 and December 1879, namely the Gaika / Galeka War, the Northern Border War, the lst and 2nd Sekukuni Wars, the Moirosi's Mountain campaign in Basutoland, and the Zulu War.

A bar or clasp was to be attached to the suspender of the medal hearing the date or dates of the year or years in which the recipient had actually served in any of those campaigns. Military personnel who had been mobilized in Natal, but had not crossed the Tugela River into Zululand, were to receive the medal without any bar.

The original Army Order, no 103 of August 1880, made no mention of any change in design of the earlier model. However, the date '1853' was clearly inappropriate, and it was therefore replaced in the reverse exergue by a military trophy consisting of a Zulu ox-hide shield and four crossed assegais.

Participants in the Zulu War received this medal without a bar if they remained on the Natal side of the Tugela, or with the bar '1879' if they actually saw service in Zululand.

One can say with confidence that a medal without a bar is a medal awarded for service in connection with the Zulu War, albeit not combatant service. Problems arise, however, when one is faced with a medal bearing the bar '1879', for the same bar was given with the medal for the Moirosi's Mountain campaign in Basutoland, and for the Second Sekukuni War in the North-Eastern Transvaal.

Unless the service details of the recipient are known, the only way to establish whether the bar '1879' was indeed for the Zulu War is to look at the name of the unit (which will be found engraved, together with the recipient's rank and name, on the edge of the medal) and to check that the unit concerned was in Zululand.

Imperial troops who participated included two regiments of cavalry and fifteen infantry battalions (see Appendix I), together with a composite Naval Brigade, detachments of the Royal Artillery and Royal Engineers, and members of the various supporting commissariat, ordnance, and medical services.

In addition there were a considerable number of 'odd men' - often officers -drawn from a wide variety of British regular and militia units who were sent out as members of the staff or as observers. Some enthusiastic adventure-seekers qualified for the medal by reaching the front line entirely on their own initiative, and even at their own expense!

The Natal colonists also played their part. Forces called out on full mobilization to meet the threat of Cetewayo's estimated 40 000 warriors included the Natal Mounted Police (a semi-military formation, and the only 'regulars) and all the Natal Volunteer units then in existence.

The Frontier Light Horse and units such as Raaff's Transvaal Rangers and the Kaffrarian Rifles came from the other colonies. Special reserve units were established in Pietermaritzburg and Durban for local garrison duty and large numbers of Natal Natives were enlisted. (see Appendix II).


The Campaign Medal for the Zulu War - the medal for "South Africa 1877-79", with bar "1879".
Left: Obverse of medal awarded to Lieut. W. Pool, Border Horse, killed in action on Hlobane Mountain.
Right: Reverse of medal awarded to Trooper J. Deane, Natal Carbineers, killed in action at Isandlwana.

The ultimate - if in practice unattainable - collection of medals of the Zulu War would include medals to all these formations. It would include not only all the 'odd-man' units on the Imperial side - to some of which only one medal was issued - but also the many small Natal units bearing such glamorous names as Carbutt's Border Rangers, Isipingo Mounted Rifles, and Weenen Yeomanry.

Alternatively, the collector can aim to represent in his collection a recipient from each of the major actions of the war. This theme involves considerable research, and final verification of participation in a particular action - unless the recipient was a casualty - can be tantalizingly difficult in the absence of personal letters or a diary. One can, however, consult the full casualty rolls for Isandlwana or Hlobane Mountain, and Chard's report on the defence of Rorke's Drift contains a comprehensive nominal roll of the defenders. Press reports, regimental histories, church or battlefield memorials - all these may provide useful information. It is interesting to record that whereas Colonial Forces Order no. 169 (issued at Kingwilliamstown on 14th September, 1880, to announce the granting of the medal) stated specifically that 'the Medal will be granted to survivors only ...', no such restrictive condition appeared in the original Imperial Army Order no.103 of 1st August, 1880. Whatever happened in the Cape of Good Hope, it is certain that medals were given to the next-of-kin of men killed in action in Zululand. Medals to Isandlwana casualties, in particular, are much sought after and command a substantial premium.

DECORATIONS FOR THE ZULU WAR

In 1879, apart from promotion in the field, or brevet rank for officers, the only available means of rewarding gallantry or distinguished service was by the award of either the Victoria Cross or the Distinguished Conduct Medal. Both of these decorations had been instituted at the end of the Crimean War. (The Distinguished Service Order was established only in 1886 and the Military Cross and Military Medal followed much later, during the 1st World War).

The Zulu War saw the award of twenty-three Victoria Crosses and 15 Distinguished Conduct Medals. The story of Lieutenants Coghill and Melvill who died fighting to the last at Fugitives Drift after their gallant attempt to save the colours when their Regiment, the 1st Battalion 24th Regiment (later The South Wales Borderers) was overrun at Isandlwana, and who were given the V.C. by King Edward VII in 1907, when posthumous awards were first authorized, is well known. It was at Fugitive's Drift, too, that Private Wassall of the 80th Regiment of Foot earned his Cross rescuing a comrade in the wild fury of the flooded Tugela under a hail of Zulu bullets.

The historic and emotion-stirring defence of Rorke's Drift on the evening of the Isandlwana disaster of the 22nd January was marked by the award of no less than 11 Victoria Crosses and 5 Distinguished Conduct Medals - an all-time record for a single action. The disasters at Hlobane Mountain and at the Intombi River likewise brought their quota of 'Valour beyond the call of duty', as did the epic victories of Kambula and Ulundi. As will be seen from the attached schedule, (Appendix III), of the major actions of the Zulu War only the gallant defence of Eshowe, and the battle on the Inyezane River, near Gingindlovu, on the 2nd April, failed to gain the distinction of a decoration. It is particularly interesting to note that two black African NCOs of the Natal Native Horse won the DCM - at Kambula and on the Umfolozi River before Ulundi respectively.

From the South African Military History Society
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10881
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 67
Location : Melbourne, Australia

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: medals zulu war.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Oct 20, 2009 7:41 am

hi all.
There are about 10 dealers I check every 3 mths or so , Last time I checked which was back in August , there were
about 30 - 40 medals for sale, I will have a closer look after dinner :lol!:
cheers 90th.
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10881
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 67
Location : Melbourne, Australia

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: medal count   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Oct 20, 2009 12:00 pm

hi all
I checked my records from the 16 sites which I look at every 3 mths or thereabouts from the 18 AUG and at that time
there were 54 medals available . The site I posted a couple of days ago " HISTORIKORDERS.COM had 16 for sale.
Which included 2 CAPT"S and 1 LT , also 1 SGT. From the other 51 medals available there was 1 CAPT, 1 2ND LT,
and 1 SGT. The rest a mixture of PVTS , GUNNERS , SEAMAN , BUGLERS , DRIVERS, BOMBADIERS, TROOPERS,
DRUMMERS, PAYMASTERS, ARMY MED CORPS.
cheers 90th.
Back to top Go down
Neil Aspinshaw

Neil Aspinshaw


Posts : 553
Join date : 2009-10-14
Location : Loughborough

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Oct 20, 2009 2:51 pm

As with any medal who'd value sky rockets due to the recipients demise (or survival) of a famous action, the South Africa madal is no exception. Over the years medals have been "re-named", Isandlwana casualties and RD defenders are not immune from that.

Unscrupilous delaers have filed off the name of some private in say the Buffs and had it re-named adding 30 times its value, always look for the signs of filing, if in doubt check the dimensions as any taken off will make the size vary or the edges will have flat spots. always ask for written proof of purchase and written agreement to money back if the edal is proven false. most bone-fide dealers will have no problem with that.


Breaon is a good first call if you want to have a quick check, Martin and celia have most of the officers medals involved at Isandlwana, plus alot of other ranks, mine will be put on loan there shortly. Do check first if you are looking to buy one to ensure they do not have it first!.

I remember many moons ago Qtr Master Pullens appearing on the antiques roadshow.


St Henry Gallaghers RD fame went recently for £38,000.

24th medals demand far higher prices than other regiments, but inreality if it is 1/24th they were either in garrison elsewhere, or bought in to re-constitute those companies lost at Isandlwana, and, were ulikely to have seen a shot fired, in many cases these will not have the 1879 clasp, or in the case of the 2/24th out with chelmsford, ok it could be argued that they were involved in the battle but the fringes.

I have sen quite a few 2/24th with the 1878 clasp as they may have left before Jan 1879.
Back to top Go down
http://www.martinihenry.org
Mr Greaves

Mr Greaves


Posts : 747
Join date : 2009-10-18

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Oct 20, 2009 7:35 pm

Neill. Would it be possible to get photos from Martin (Not sure who he is) of the medals in-question? Or a least a list of names of those whose medals are in the Museum.
If some could send me Martin's contact details i will ask him.

G.
Back to top Go down
1879graves

1879graves


Posts : 3361
Join date : 2009-03-03
Location : Devon

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Oct 20, 2009 7:54 pm

Major Martin Everett TD FRGS
South Wales Borderers Museum
The Barracks
Brecon
Powys
LD3 7EB
Tel: 01874 613310
martin.everett@rrw.org.uk
swb@rrw.org.uk
Back to top Go down
http://zuluwar1879.tribalpages.com
Chelmsfordthescapegoat

Chelmsfordthescapegoat


Posts : 2593
Join date : 2009-04-24

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Oct 20, 2009 7:57 pm

Mr Greaves.

Martin Everett .
Regimental Museum of The Royal Welsh
Brecon LD3 7EB

email: swb@rrw.org.uk
Back to top Go down
Mr Greaves

Mr Greaves


Posts : 747
Join date : 2009-10-18

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyTue Oct 20, 2009 7:59 pm

Much-obliged CTSG.

G.
Back to top Go down
garywilson1

garywilson1


Posts : 374
Join date : 2009-01-22
Age : 61
Location : Timisoara , Romania

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyWed Oct 21, 2009 1:17 pm

So does there exist anywhere a list of the whereabouts of the mdals of those at Ishandlwana , KIA or survivors - likewise for RD ?

as i see it there are 5 possibilities for each medal ;

1- never claimed and thus was remelted down
2- claimed but later lost - current whereabouts unknown
3 - stiil with the descendents of the awardee
4-sold and now in a private collection
5-in a public museum.
Back to top Go down
Mr Greaves

Mr Greaves


Posts : 747
Join date : 2009-10-18

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyWed Oct 21, 2009 3:22 pm

Hi Gary.
I'm going to make contact with Martin Everett, has Neill says there are quite a lot of medals there. I will post his reply, when I receive it.

G.
Back to top Go down
Chelmsfordthescapegoat

Chelmsfordthescapegoat


Posts : 2593
Join date : 2009-04-24

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Oct 23, 2009 11:40 pm

Any news yet. Mr Greaves.
Back to top Go down
Mr Greaves

Mr Greaves


Posts : 747
Join date : 2009-10-18

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptyFri Oct 23, 2009 11:51 pm

Hi CTSG.

I only sent the e-mail about an hour ago. So nothing yet.

G.
Back to top Go down
Mr Greaves

Mr Greaves


Posts : 747
Join date : 2009-10-18

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySat Oct 24, 2009 1:28 pm

This morning I received e-mail from Mr Everett.

"We only hold 15 medals of those actually killed at Isandlwana - out of nearly 600 men of the 24th who were present at the action. So the majority of campaign medals are in other collections. In addition to the 15 are those to Lt Melvill and Lt Coghill. It is not trustees' policy to publish details of museum's medal collection for security reasons. You could purchase a copy of 'The Noble 24th' by Norman Holme which does indicate those in the museum collection. See museum website."

Of course Mr Everett is right, when it comes to the security of the medals. Does anyone own a copy of the Noble 24th? As much of the information we are after is in there.

G.
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10881
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 67
Location : Melbourne, Australia

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: J. Hind K.I.A. ISANDLWANA   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Oct 25, 2009 8:01 am

hi mr.greaves.
I have a copy of the noble 24th , but to find the medals that are at the museum requires reading some 300 pages which are the
names of all the 24th troops entitled to the zulu war medal , as there isnt a list of whose medals are at the museum from those killed at Isandlwana , there is only a notation at the end of those killed at Isandlwana which says ( regimental property ). These
I assume are the medals held at Brecon. If you are interested , I have posted a link for the NOBLE 24TH , not sure where ,
so here it is again.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/THE-NOBLE-24TH-ZULU-WAR-NORMAN-HOLME_W0QQitemZ170395760550QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAntiquarian_Books_UK?hash=item27ac60f7a6.

An absolute bargain , dont worry about the postage cost as that is the price to Australia.
The museum at Brecon sells them for 20-25 quid. Thats what I paid for mine :lol!:
cheers 90th.
Back to top Go down
Mr Greaves

Mr Greaves


Posts : 747
Join date : 2009-10-18

pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. Empty
PostSubject: Re: pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.   pvt . J. Hind. KIA  ISANDLWANA. EmptySun Oct 25, 2009 1:51 pm

Thanks 90th. I have checked out the museum website. But that doe's not show what medals are there.

G.
Back to top Go down
 
pvt . J. Hind. KIA ISANDLWANA.
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM  :: 1879 ZULU WAR CAMPAIGN MEDAL-
Jump to: