WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM

Film Zulu Quote: Lieutenant John Chard The army doesn't like more than one disaster in a day. Bromhead Looks bad in the newspapers and upsets civilians at their breakfast
 
HomeHome  CalendarCalendar  GalleryGallery  PublicationsPublications  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  
Latest topics
» William Britain's Zulu War dioramas
Today at 4:24 am by ArendH

» A photograph of the NNC
Thu Dec 13, 2018 4:32 pm by rusteze

» The difference between a Drummer and a Boy in the Band.
Thu Dec 13, 2018 12:40 pm by Kenny

» Quartermaster-Sergeant, Thomas Leach was killed in action at Isandhlwana on 22nd January 1879
Thu Dec 13, 2018 12:57 am by littlehand

» Was Durnford responsible for sending troops out the camp?
Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:39 pm by 90th

» Suspending new registrations until further notice.
Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:06 am by ADMIN

» Studies in the Zulu War 1879 Volume V
Wed Dec 12, 2018 7:50 am by Julian Whybra

» Another 'what if'!
Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:33 pm by rusteze

» Rorke's Drift Diorama - 1:72 Scale
Sun Dec 09, 2018 5:19 pm by ArendH

» Ralph B Leslie, Civil Surgeon Doctor
Fri Dec 07, 2018 6:58 pm by 1879graves

» Lieut-Col Ambrose Humphrys Bircham
Fri Dec 07, 2018 12:43 am by 90th

» A Tale Of The Last Zulu Campaign
Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:48 pm by Paymaster 24th Foot

» Francis Freeman White Paymaster & Major 2/24th
Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:21 pm by Paymaster 24th Foot

» Lieutenant AP Hillier
Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:58 am by Rory Reynolds

» 1:72 Diorama of Ulundi
Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:13 pm by Jager1

Captain David Moriarity, 80th, KIA Ntombe
This photograph taken when he was in the 7th Regiment prior to his transfer to the 80th. [Mac & Shad] (Isandula Collection)
The Battle of Isandlwana: One of The Worst Defeats of The British Empire - Military History
Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
Top posters
90th
 
littlehand
 
Frank Allewell
 
ADMIN
 
rusteze
 
1879graves
 
Chelmsfordthescapegoat
 
John
 
Mr M. Cooper
 
impi
 
Fair Use Notice
Fair use notice. This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner. We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website. If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution.
Top posting users this month
rusteze
 
John Young
 
Frank Allewell
 
SRB1965
 
90th
 
ymob
 
Julian Whybra
 
aussie inkosi
 
1879graves
 
ArendH
 
Most active topics
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Durnford was he capable.1
Durnford was he capable.5
Durnford was he capable. 4
The ammunition question
Durnford was he capable. 3
Durnford was he capable.2
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.

Share | 
 

 The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.

Go down 
AuthorMessage
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:09 pm

I have recently acquired this print from The Pictorial World of 15th March 1879.

The engraving was based on a sketch supplied to the newspaper by Lt. William James Fowler, of 'N' Battery, 5th Brigade, Royal Artillery.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
John Young Collection.

Apologies for the quality as the engraving is very large for my scanner and having the resort to other means.

Frankly, I had seen the engraving prior to it being offered to me.

Has anyone seen this engraving before?

John Y.
Back to top Go down
ADMIN

avatar

Posts : 3772
Join date : 2008-11-01
Age : 59
Location : KENT

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:06 am

First time for me John.


[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

"William James Fowler was born on 21 July 1847, son of George Campbell Fowler, Captain, R.N., of Crookham End, Berkshire. He entered the army as Lieutenant in the Royal Artillery on 15 July 1868, and served in India from January 1869 until January 1874, after which he proceeded to the Cape. He served in the Kaffir War of 1877-78, and in the Zulu War of 1879, with N Battery 5th Brigade, in command of the two guns left on detachment at Fort Evelyn. Fowler was promoted to Captain on 16 August 1879 and continued to serve at the Cape until March 1880. He returned to India once more and served there from May 1881 to September 1884, and from December 1885 until February 1889, having been promoted to Major on 24 February 1885. He became Lieutenant-Colonel on 20 February 1895, and was subsequently on the Staff of the Western Division Artillery, becoming Brevet Colonel on 20 February 1899. He retired exactly one year later and died on 1 September 1918."
Back to top Go down
http://www.1879zuluwar.com
90th

avatar

Posts : 9877
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 62
Location : Melbourne, Australia

PostSubject: The Camp at Isandula 22nd Jan 79   Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:52 am

I cant remember seeing it previously JY , if Fowler drew it from what he saw he must've been out with LC , as he wasn't an Isandlwana Survivor .
90th
Back to top Go down
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 1:11 am

Admin,

Thanks for that detail from his medal sale.

Gary,

Yes he was out with Arthur Harness and two sections of guns from the Battery.

John Y.
Back to top Go down
90th

avatar

Posts : 9877
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 62
Location : Melbourne, Australia

PostSubject: The Camp at Isandula 22nd Jan 79   Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:56 am

Hi JY
Luckily for him !
90th Shocked Joker
Back to top Go down
Chelmsfordthescapegoat

avatar

Posts : 2567
Join date : 2009-04-24

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 7:23 am

I haven't see this sketch before, but its the best one i have ever seen.
Back to top Go down
90th

avatar

Posts : 9877
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 62
Location : Melbourne, Australia

PostSubject: The Camp at Isandula 22nd Jan 79   Fri Jun 23, 2017 10:22 am

Was browsing through Ian Knight's ' Brave Men's Blood ' today and lo and behold that picture that JY posted is on page 64 , although its much darker than the picture posted by JY , so obviously I'd seen it but didn't remember , wonder if its any other AZW Publications ? .
90th scratch
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

avatar

Posts : 7039
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 71
Location : Cape Town South Africa

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 10:38 am

Interesting 90th, in my copy its on page 57?
Back to top Go down
90th

avatar

Posts : 9877
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 62
Location : Melbourne, Australia

PostSubject: The Camp at Isandula 22nd Jan 79   Fri Jun 23, 2017 10:41 am

Hi Frank
I have the Paperback , is yours the Hard Cover edition ???
90th scratch
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

avatar

Posts : 7039
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 71
Location : Cape Town South Africa

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 10:55 am

Ah mystery solved.
Talking of mysteries and old drawings, Ive been trying to locate a sketch by William Walton of the body of Ntshingwayo kaMahole. Any ideas, anyone?
Back to top Go down
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 11:42 am

Frank,

That's that one solved, it obviously hadn't stayed with me.

William Walton provided a number of sketches for the same publication The Pictorial World in 1883/4. The sketch that you are looking for is in the MuseuMAfrica [sic] Lilian Ngoyi St, Newtown, Johannesburg, 2033. Reference W89.

John Y.
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

avatar

Posts : 7039
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 71
Location : Cape Town South Africa

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:02 pm

Thanks John
I did have the reference but I was hoping to find a published source with the photo. Its not so much the photo but the hand written title I wanted to confirm.
Regards
Back to top Go down
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:09 pm

Frank,

It is in Laband's The Atlas of the Later Zulu Wars 1883-1888 page 58, the handwriting appears to read - 'Chinguio led at Rorkes Drift'.

John Y.
Back to top Go down
90th

avatar

Posts : 9877
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 62
Location : Melbourne, Australia

PostSubject: The Camp at Isandula 22nd Jan 79   Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:15 pm

Hi Frank
I wonder if that pic you seek might be in a Laband Book , he did a book on the Later Zulu Wars from memory ? , I don't have it to check , Les might have it , there isn't many books he doesn't have ! .
90th scratch
Back to top Go down
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:23 pm

90th,

You need to change your name to Lance-Corporal Jones...

JY
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

avatar

Posts : 7039
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 71
Location : Cape Town South Africa

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:38 pm


That's the sentence I was looking for, a garbling of his name but linking him with RD.

Cheers
Back to top Go down
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
Frank Allewell

avatar

Posts : 7039
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 71
Location : Cape Town South Africa

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:13 pm

Thank you Les
The reason for the curiosity with the statement is that this drawing was done after Ntshingwayo was killed at the battle of Ondini, 1883 I think. At that point the partition of Zululand had been done and the kingdom split up into 13 units. So by this time the basic outlines of the 1879 campaign where known including who the commanders were. And as history tells us Ntshingwayo was joint commander at iSandlwana not RD. One would have thought that William Walton would have known that !
Back to top Go down
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:53 pm

Frank,

I have to agree with you, but Walton may have influenced by his travelling companion, Zibhebhu kaMaphitha in what he wrote. You know they say about victors writing history.

John Y.
Back to top Go down
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
Frank Allewell

avatar

Posts : 7039
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 71
Location : Cape Town South Africa

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Sat Jun 24, 2017 8:18 am

I actually have the book, it was in the box with the rest of Robs collection, most of which I haven't got around to yet.
Back to top Go down
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
aussie inkosi



Posts : 95
Join date : 2013-09-16
Age : 53
Location : MELBOURNE

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:16 am

xhosa2000 wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

What a sad end for the master of Isandlwana
Back to top Go down
Online
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
SRB1965

avatar

Posts : 619
Join date : 2017-05-13
Age : 53
Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:29 pm

There seems to be about 4 photos, which look (to my untrained eye) as the same group of people.

Especially of the study posted by Xhosa, yesterday - which seem to have the same 'retainers'/family members and a similar patterned shield

Unfortunately I have not yet sussed out how to post images but a quick search on Google will bring them up

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

This seems to be an engraving/sketch based on the group as well (about halfway down the page)

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Cheers

simon
Back to top Go down
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
Frank Allewell

avatar

Posts : 7039
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 71
Location : Cape Town South Africa

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:45 am

Ntshingwayo wasn't included in the original subdivision of Zulu land. All thirteen sections were allocated and the documentation of grant completed. One was then crossed out and Ntshingwayos name added. Ive never managed to trace down the oral history that the two met and the grant wa changed after the meeting. Virtually none of the 'Command Structure' were interviewed though. At least there is no records of any meetings,
One day they may just turn up.
Back to top Go down
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
90th

avatar

Posts : 9877
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 62
Location : Melbourne, Australia

PostSubject: The Camp at Isandula 22nd Jan 79   Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:49 pm

Hi Les
I'm fairly confident it is Mehlokazulu behind Ntshingwayo .
90th Salute
Back to top Go down
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:00 pm

Les,

There is an engraving of him in The Graphic 4th October 1879, the title refers to him as Tshingwayo, A Great General. The engraving is indistinct as to which figure he actually is though. However, if you take a look at page 253 of Victoria's Harvest at the photograph titled as Zulu izinduna listen to the fate of their nation..., it is not inconceivable that him numbers in that group as it shows the same event.

John Y.
Back to top Go down
1879graves

avatar

Posts : 2754
Join date : 2009-03-03
Location : Devon

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:03 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Back to top Go down
http://zuluwar1879.tribalpages.com
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:40 pm

Les,

Are you talking about the engraving or the photograph?

JY
Back to top Go down
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:19 pm

Les,

Try this:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Zulu Surrender, Ulundi, 1st September 1879
John Young Collection.

There was another photograph of the group, taken from the side which is no longer in my collection.

JY
Back to top Go down
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
John Young

avatar

Posts : 1761
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 62
Location : Lower Sheering, Essex

PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:23 pm

Les,

Just as an aside Nthingwayo's descendant, Dr. Paul Matawele, was on BBC 1 this week in his role as a microbiologist discussing the inferred health issues of refilling plastic water bottles.

At least those at iSandlwana didn't have plastic water bottles.

JY
Back to top Go down
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.   

Back to top Go down
 
The Camp at Isandula, on the Morning of January 22nd.
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM  :: LINKS & IMAGES RELATING TO THE ZULU WAR 1879-
Jump to: