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 William Brighton

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Julian Whybra




Posts : 3268
Join date : 2011-09-12
Location : Billericay, Essex

William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyMon Nov 15, 2021 8:45 am

A general enquiry really...someone has asked me if I know of a William Brighton, an OR, who time-expired/deserted from the Army in (Natal possibly Transvaal) South Africa 1878-1881. Regiment unknown. I've checked the 24th and there's no Brighton there.
Purely on the off chance has anyone ever come across a time-expired man or deserter of that name?
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John Young

John Young


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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyMon Nov 15, 2021 10:26 am

Julian,

No trace on the 1877-8-9 medal roll.

JY
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Julian Whybra




Posts : 3268
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Location : Billericay, Essex

William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyMon Nov 15, 2021 10:34 am

Thanks, John, I suppose though that if he was a deserter then he wouldn't have appeared in the 1877-8-9 medal roll. There's a suggestion that the man 'left' the army during or at the end of the First Boer War in 1880/1.
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Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyMon Nov 15, 2021 11:22 am

There is a family in Pretoria with a common thread of William running through the ancestors
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John Young

John Young


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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyMon Nov 15, 2021 11:23 am

Julian,

Deserters do appear on the Medal Rolls, normally the entry is noted with words of to the effect ‘Deserted - No Issue of Medal’, or simply ‘Deserted - No Medal’ as in the case of a Rorke’s Drift defender.

JY


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Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


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PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyMon Nov 15, 2021 11:27 am

And not them, very nice lady on the phone, her family arrived in SA early 20's.
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Julian Whybra




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PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyMon Nov 15, 2021 5:08 pm

Curiously, William Brighton did have a son William. William Senior seems to have lived as a tenant farmer on a plot of land that belonged to and was sold by Pomeroy Colley from 1880/1. His local nickname was Redcoat and he is buried on the now derelict property, the grave marked by a rough stone. My (ex-army) enquirer would like to establish his identity and raise a proper gravestone.
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gardner1879

gardner1879


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PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyWed Nov 17, 2021 5:46 pm

I have not come across anyone of that name and so have had a bit of a dig around.
How confidant, Julian, is your source that he was in SA?

I know its a long shot  but I have found a couple of records to a William Brighton and the dates are in the right decades:-

1/ Private William Brighton service number 1186 1st Battalion, 2nd (Queens Royal) Regiment of Foot stationed in India in 1871.
National Archives reference WO 12/2078

2/William Brighton service number 1186, Queens Royal West Surrey Regiment 2nd Foot attested 6th September 1866, discharge 24th October 1886. Cause of discharge 'after 18 years according to article 1034a 10.6.84.'
Seems he attained the rank of sergeant at his discharge.
The National Archives  Series WO 121 - Chelsea: Pensioners' Discharge Documents 1760-1887
Reference WO 121 Box 0248

There is also something in the Norwich Mercury 6th February 1886 of him playing the bassoon at a concert in the Wesleyan school in Diss.

The fly in the ointment is that this regiment was not in SA.
If your source is confidant he was in/stayed in SA then please ignore the above.
Kate Very Happy
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Julian Whybra




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PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyWed Nov 17, 2021 9:45 pm

Kate
That is excellent work. Thank you. I'll pass this on to the source and see what he says. From what I've gathered already he is fairly confident that Brighton was in situ in SA 1881-4-ish. I'll let you know the outcome.
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John Young

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PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyWed Nov 17, 2021 9:59 pm

George Pomeroy Colley served in the 2nd (The Queen’s Royal) Regiment from 1852.

JY
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rai




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PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyWed Nov 17, 2021 10:05 pm

Hi All,
A William Brighton b.1848 Diss Norfolk, attested 15 sept 1866 No.1186 1/2 Foot, Home service from 6 sept 1866, to India 9 march 1868, to UK 7 April 1879 to discharge 24 Aug 1886 in Dublin. He was in Belgaum India 1871, when he landed back in the UK in 1879 he was stationed at colchester and went to Aldershot 17 feb 1881. No South African Service. He married Eliza Cook [Coak] in Diss Norfolk 10 Jan 1883.
Rai KLH
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Frank Allewell

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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 4:49 am

There are records of a William Brighton in Pretoria in1906, still following up.
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Julian Whybra




Posts : 3268
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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 8:39 am

Wow! All good stuff! The source has come back to me with this:

"I am certain of very little about Billy Brighton Sr. except of his nickname and reputation as a redcoat, his grave and cottage.

When I was 25 in 1980 I met his son, Billy Brighton Jr and estimate BB Jr then to have been about 70

My recent age calculation says, from the above, that BB Sr must have been SECOND ABW not AZW or FIRST ABW.

If BB Jr was 70 in 1980, then his puts his DOB 1910

If BB Sr had a child BB Jr age 20 or age 30 it rules out AZW or FIRST ABW (contrary to local lore)

BUT puts BB Sr at 19-29 for SECOND ABW.

SO his nickname as a Redcoat is a colloquialism by an Afrikaans community who identified him as a Brit soldier ….

I am trying to follow up a female descendant and see what I can learn from her."

As so often with local lore and rumour, it never turns out to be quite what it's been built up to be. but thanks everyone for chipping in. It WAS appreciated by the source and by me. It does look as though some of what's been found might be of use.

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gardner1879

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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 8:59 am

No trace of a William Brighton in Watt's 'In Memoriam. Roll of Honour Imperial Forces 1899-1902'
Which suggests he survived.
Closest is a PTE W. Brightman service number 5279, Royal West Kents. Died at sea 27.03.1900
Kate
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John Young

John Young


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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 10:06 am

SO his nickname as a Redcoat is a colloquialism by an Afrikaans community who identified him as a Brit soldier ….

There was I under the impression it was rooinek - red neck.

JY
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Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


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Age : 75
Location : Cape Town South Africa

William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 11:42 am

I agree John, up on the veld it would definitly be Rooinek or Soutpiel.
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Julian Whybra




Posts : 3268
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Location : Billericay, Essex

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PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 12:49 pm

My source is a local whose land adjoined the younger Brighton. He's adamant everyone called him 'Redcoat' when he was alive. I'll pass the info on to see what he thinks.
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John Young

John Young


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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 1:18 pm

Julian,

I’m convinced the same query was made on the defunct Victorian Wars Forum, and we came up against a brick wall then.

JY
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Julian Whybra




Posts : 3268
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William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 3:56 pm

I'll ask.
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Julian Whybra




Posts : 3268
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Location : Billericay, Essex

William Brighton Empty
PostSubject: Re: William Brighton   William Brighton EmptyThu Nov 18, 2021 4:04 pm

Nope, he's never heard of the VF Forum; it's the first time he's ever tried to chase the matter.
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