William Moore / William Potter 24th Regiment

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Lancaster Observer and Morecambe Chronicle - Friday 14 March 1879

Captain Harrison -Col. Henry Albert Harrisson 1/24th SAGSM 1877-78 in command of H company at St John's River.
M+S shows Harrisson with one 's' Harts with two.

No William Moore in the 1/24th
986 William Moore 2/24th.
SAGSM 1877-78-79

25B/164 Pte William Potter who enlisted age 22 years at Liverpool 5.4.1874 was with Captain Henry Harrisson who commanded H Company 1/24th at St John's River on 22 January 1879.  Potter received SAGM 1877-8-9 with clasp 1977-8.  The subject of this post needs to be changed.

SAGSM 1977-78 clasp?

Obliviously, as a dedicated AWZ enthusiast, you require more information:

On 17 August 1878, Captain Harrisson (B Company 1/24th) with Lieutenants Spring and Roche and 85 ORs left King William's Town to the mouth of the St John's River. They established Fort Harrisson and remained there during the Zulu war.

On 11 May 1879 when Major Dunbar took command of 1/24th at Dundee after the first invasion, the companies of the 1/24th (with the new drafts) were re-designated. B Company still at St John's River became H Company 1/24th. The new H Company (Harrisson) remained at St John's River and did not re-join the other companies of 1/24th then at Pinetown until 20 August 1879.

Men of H (formerly B) Company did not qualify for the '1879' clasp and easily be identified on the 1/24th Medal Roll (if you ignore those killed or went home after the Frontier war).

The original H Company 1/24th was at Isandhlana was commanded by Wardell.  

Harrisson baptismal entry - Casterton Parva, Rutland - April 14, 1841 - shows him as son of Everson and Matilda Harrisson.

Gardner1879,

Thank you for the upload, pity the letter mentioned was not printed.

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If the above loaded?? a piece from the same newspaper dated 05/12/1879.

I did a bit of digging and found the following:

Peter Moore married Eleanor (Ellen) Armistead (sometimes Armstead/Armitstead), Ulverston, Lancashire, Q3 1851. A son William was born Q3 1851. A second son James was born Q2 1857, Peter had an occupation of Publican. Peter died sometime before August 1873 as Ellen Moore, born [circa] 1834, age 39, widow, Market Street (father John Armitstead) married Edward Potter, born [circa] 1846, aged 27, Railway [worker], Alfred Street on the 12/08/1873. It would appear that Edward died aged 33 in Q2 1880, Lancaster.

Now William Potter 25B/164 appears to be discharged from Section B 1st Class Army Reserve on/around 06/05/1886, but I wonder what date he moved from the colours to the reserve 1880, 1881? The reason I ask is an entry on the 1881 Census, living in King Street, Lancaster, Lancashire is Ellen Potter, born [circa] 1832, age 49, widow with two sons William Moore, born [circa] 1852 and James Moore, born [circa] 1857, age 24. Ellen is described as a retired innkeeper, William as an unemployed painter and James as a printer and compositor.

At the time of the marriage in 1873 William would have been in his early 20's, would he have taken his step-father's name or maybe he only used it to enlist. If he only used it to enlist are we considering annotating any future reference material as William Potter alias William Moore

Maybe I am on the wrong track with the census material but there are too many similarities to be ignored.

regards
Dash

Pte William Potter 25B/164 is listed on 1/24th medal roll with clasp 1877-8 - so is likely to have served in B Coy (later H Coy) 1/24th at St John's River - his real name certainly could have been William Moore.

However, he does not appear to be related to Pte William Moore 25B/986 (clasp 1877-8-9) who served in C Coy 2/24th.

Kenny,

I have no issue with the individual being a member of B Coy stationed at St John's River, Pondoland for the duration of war. 25B/164 Potter is an obvious possibility given the connection by name and the newspaper article uploaded by Gardner1879 and the correction to 1-24th in the second article.

The date of discharge from the regular army to the reserve was of interest to me when searching the census records. On the 1881 census (as I am sure you know), the 1-24th had a number of locations, Brecon, the infantry camp at St Botolph's in Essex, the battery at Shotley and Landguard Fort, Jetty Huts in Suffolk. I did not find a William Potter at any of the locations, he may have been on furlough, on a course of instruction, I may have missed him or he was already discharged which would make the details for King Street in 1881 a stronger possibility as to identity. Hopefully somebody with access to the pay and muster rolls for the period could answer that one way or another.

Regards
Dash

At that time the period of service was 12 years - 7 years with the Colours, 5 years on the Reserve. This would suggest that William Potter would have been eligible for transferred to the Reserve on or about 5.4.1881 within 2 days of the 1881 census. Perhaps Bill Sherriff has more information.

25B/164 William Potter enlisted Liverpool District 5th May 1874. aged 22yrs 6 months. At Brecon from the 9th.
To Army Reserve 10th May 1880. Address stated as Blue Anchor, Quayside, Lancaster. WO 16/1575 Apr/Sep Qtr.
Enlisted as Potter, used Potter throughout his service.
Do you have the RG 11 reference for Shotley/Landguard Fort?

Bill,

Thank you for the information. The date he transferred to the Army Reserve caught my eye, as did the connection to the pub trade.

Now this is where I show myself up to be a traction engine in the world of race cars, RG 11? please forgive my ignorance

Regards
Dash

RG 11 is the reference for the 1881 Census returns, normally shown by the side of the image if you used Ancestry etc.
I've copied the Barracks listing from Colchester RG 11 1788_1793 images 233 to 288 (Ancestry) but hadn't realised they had outposts at Landguard Fort. Thought you might have that reference.

Bill

Bill,

Not sure if this will help (I use findmypast) but here goes:

I used the name Neville Bower(s) for the search for Landguard

RG11, piece No. 1881, folio 26, page 7, schedule 991, Parish Felixstowe, County Suffolk, Registration district Woodbridge, sub district Colneis

I used the name Thomas Hardy for the search for Shotley
RG11, piece No. 1866, folio 12, page 17, schedule 222, Parish Shotley, County Suffolk, Registration district Sarnford, sub district Holbrook

Not sure if any of that is what you really wanted but hope it helps in some way

Regards
Dash

Bill,

An article in the Lancaster Gazette dated 06/09/1876 has Mrs Ellen Potter stating 'her husband kept the Blue Anchor Inn, St George's Quay, Lancaster'

So I may be onto something with the William Potter/William Moore.

Regards
Dash

Hi all,

Will try and tie up the loose ends on this one. I would like to thank Bill and Kenny for the information they have shared on this topic, without which I would not have found the bits and pieces which link the two names.

I will gloss over some of the details from earlier on in the topic, but will try to add detail as required.

Peter and Ellen Moore had at least 7 children during the marriage, (all dates circa) William (1851), John (1853), Thomas (1855), James (1857), Betty (1859), Mary (1860), Nancy (1863).

Peter Moore dies 21/08/1868 - probate date 04/11/1872, Lancaster; Effects under £800. Administration of the effects of Peter Moore, late of the 'New Inn', Lancaster, in the County of Lancaster, Innkeeper who died 21/08/1868 at Tewitfield, in the Parish of Warton, in the said County was granted to Ellen Moore of the 'New Inn' widow of the relict.

1871 Census - shows Ellen (Innkeeper), with John, Thomas, the three girls and two servants living at the New Inn, Market Street, Lancaster. James possibly living as a boarder in Grasmere Road, working as a clerk at a wagon works (possibly the Lancaster Carriage & Wagon Works. Edward Potter living in St Leonard Gate, Lancaster, fireman, born Ockbrook, Derbyshire. No trace of William.

Ellen married Edward Potter, August 1873.

Lancaster Gazette newspaper 27/09/1873 - An altercation (bar room scuffle) took place at the New Inn, Market Street between John Moore and Edward Potter. Edward is described as having recently married into the family.

Lancaster Gazette newspaper 06/09/1876 - Ellen Potter is called to give evidence in the death Sgt Reedwood (natural causes), as previously reported she states 'her husband kept the Blue Anchor Inn, St George's Quay, Lancaster.

Lancaster Gazette newspaper 12/06/1880 - Transfer of Licence, The Blue Anchor, St George's Quay, Lancaster, from the late Edward Potter to Joseph Ellison

1881 Census - shows Ellen (retired innkeeper), living with William and James at 4 Kings Street, Lancaster. Thomas is possibly living close by at 3 Kings Place, Lancaster, married with a daughter called Eleanor.

I can find no evidence of Edward Potter having been married or having children prior to August 1873. William born circa 1851 clearly cannot be his child. There is no hard evidence to suggest that William took the name Potter before enlistment but likewise it cannot be ruled out. The evidence of a William Moore living with his mother in 1881 could suggest Potter was only used for the term of his enlistment. The Blue Anchor ties the story together, Potter used it for his place of residence on leaving the colours.

That is all I have to offer at this time, without a service record there will always be an element of doubt but hopefully I have put enough detail together to aid identification.

Any comments or suggestions are welcomed.

Regards
Dash