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Lord Chelmsford Said .Buller is ‘one of the finest soldiers of the century’, so modest and reticent –that it was difficult to say for what individual deed he had got the Victoria Cross as he had been doing acts worthy of it all along the line
 
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» One of the lesser-known stories. It took place around the same time as Isandlwana.
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyYesterday at 11:36 pm by WeekendWarrior

» NNC Officer List
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» N Batt 5th Bde RA
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» S.SMITH Buffalo Border Guard
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» Questions of Time and Place at Isandlwana
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» Question Regarding the Uniforms of the Officers of the 24th at Isandlwana
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyFri Jul 03, 2020 6:06 am by SRB1965

» Malicious malware on this site
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» Zulu Victory - Views?
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» Isandlwana Survivor photo's
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» Anyone got information on this.
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyThu Jul 02, 2020 3:55 pm by Julian Whybra

» Captn. H. G. Bowen, 88th Foot
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyThu Jul 02, 2020 1:18 pm by gstew88

» The South Africa Medal to HMS Forester - an anomaly?
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyWed Jul 01, 2020 7:41 pm by Petty Officer Tom

» Lieut. R. F. Dixon NMR
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyWed Jul 01, 2020 5:01 am by 90th

» Next month's DNW medal auction
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyTue Jun 30, 2020 6:45 am by 90th

» Zulu war medals on eBay
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyMon Jun 29, 2020 5:14 pm by SergioD

» John Basten
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySun Jun 28, 2020 1:20 pm by Petty Officer Tom

» Lieutenant Walter Robert Higginson NNC
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySun Jun 28, 2020 11:19 am by ciroferrara

» Letter home from Eshowe
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyThu Jun 25, 2020 2:24 pm by Blackcat

» Melvill's Revolver Cylinder
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» Assistant Commissary W. Winspear Commissariat Department, present at Gingindlovu
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyMon Jun 22, 2020 12:05 pm by ADMIN

» Orders to laager at Isandhlwana
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySun Jun 21, 2020 7:11 pm by SRB1965

» morale and the siege at Eshowe
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyFri Jun 19, 2020 9:58 am by Blackcat

» CUNNINGHAM
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyFri Jun 19, 2020 8:43 am by Julian Whybra

» ISANDLWANA SURVIVIORS
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySat Jun 13, 2020 6:21 am by 90th

» Diamond Fields Horse in Zululand
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyFri Jun 12, 2020 3:01 pm by Rory Reynolds

» Crimes back in England
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyThu Jun 11, 2020 3:44 pm by Catiline63

» Brevet Major. Henry Spalding of Rorke's Drift and Information for Columns
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySat Jun 06, 2020 12:14 pm by Frank Allewell

» Missing Cairns?
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySat Jun 06, 2020 4:04 am by WeekendWarrior

» RE: William Jenkins Goodson
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyThu Jun 04, 2020 8:09 pm by John Young

» A note on O/6 Battery, Royal Artillery.
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySun May 31, 2020 4:09 pm by lydenburg

» Corps of Drums
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySun May 31, 2020 10:10 am by John Young

» 2nd Lieutenant Henry Wilson Lovett, 1st/13th
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySat May 30, 2020 11:48 am by John Young

» Philip Bowe 2658/7 Gatling Field Battery 10/7 Brigade Major Owens
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyFri May 29, 2020 7:28 pm by Doranking

» Lieutenant O'Connell, 60th Rifles. 1880 Isandlwana map.
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyTue May 26, 2020 4:32 pm by Frank Allewell

» More From FindaGrave website
Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyTue May 26, 2020 8:09 am by rai

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Rorke's Drift A Soldier's Story with presenter Major John Thomas
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 Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison

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sas1

sas1

Posts : 629
Join date : 2009-01-20
Age : 42

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PostSubject: Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison   Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyWed Feb 02, 2011 11:18 pm

Read this last night. Well researched..
Click Here
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Saul David 1879



Posts : 527
Join date : 2009-02-28

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PostSubject: Re: Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison   Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyThu Feb 03, 2011 10:26 pm

Thanks sas1. That was put together really well, Very good read.
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Ray63

Ray63

Posts : 708
Join date : 2012-05-05

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PostSubject: Re: Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison   Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySun Oct 28, 2012 7:15 pm

"1. Custer was operating on assumptions. He did now know the location of the village, except all indications pointed north of Ford A. He knew the Indians were coming out to meet Reno in force.

He did not know the terrain in the valley. He did not know how the terrain would affect the valley fight, and the advantages/disadvantages this would offer for Reno's attack.

This is unusual behavior for LTC Custer. His historical record shows that he likes to get far forward and make an early assessment.


2. This implies the move right was both an effort to gain exploit a supposed tactical opportunity, as well as a chance to find high ground to get a look into the valley. There was some confusion on Custer's intent with his scouts. Two scouts he had intended to scale the bluffs followed Reno instead. Mitch Bouyer led the remaining Crows, followed by GAC himself. Reno was still advancing down the valley and wasn't in contact.

3. The problem is that Custer was putting two terrain features between him and his own designated advance guard. He failed to inform his advance guard and other 2 separate Bns what he was doing. Ouiji board leadership is not generally recommended.
If he did plan to go right, then it was essential to move quickly to reestablish contact with Reno. This means moving along the bluffs until he finds a ford, then crossing and heading south to reach Reno.

During this period Reno is totally on his own, facing Custer's estimated 1,500 Indians.

4. Reno's dilemma. Reno's job was to find and develop enemy situation. He most certainly did. He found a massive pny herd on his left, and the south edge of village to his front. Hundreds of Indians were boiling out to meet him. He sent 2 messengers back to CUster informing him of the situation.
It was now the responsibility of the main body to react to enemy activity. Reno's force was too small to control the valley and he needed support on his right. Custer should have moved forward to right behind Reno to establish a command post, while sending a battalion to extend the regimental line to the left, holding his last Bn in reserve.

Manuals at the time spent extensive time on the orders and movements to shift a movement to contact into a battle line.

Reno was stuck by Custer's action. He had met the enemy and deployed. He had sent 2 messengers back. Custer should appear momentarily. Custer owed him a response, since Reno had completed his advance guard mission.

And Custer did not show. Reno's hesitation in the valley has a significant causal factor by the failure of the main body to show up.

5. Why was no messenger sent? Custer had left the main body and went up the bluffs. He signaled the main body to follow by waving his hat , according to surviving Crows. SO the responsibility to send messengers was with his staff, meaning Lt Cooke and CPT Custer.And they didn't do it. Custer did not tolerate independent decision making from his subordinates. He had chewed out Tom for moving the column that morning. When messengers were finally launched"
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littlehand

littlehand

Posts : 7086
Join date : 2009-04-24
Age : 51
Location : Down South.

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PostSubject: Re: Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison   Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySun Oct 28, 2012 7:25 pm

Uncanny isn't it,
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tasker224

tasker224

Posts : 2102
Join date : 2010-07-30
Age : 53
Location : North London

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PostSubject: Re: Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison   Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptyMon Oct 29, 2012 9:54 am

"Custer did not tolerate independent decision making from his subordinates. He had chewed out Tom for moving the column that morning"

Most uncanny, but entirely unsurprising.
You can't micro-manage a campaign, or even a battle.
Hitler, Custer and Chelmsford all screwed up and failed, because they COULD NOT DO what all good generals, managers (and leaders such as Churchill, and dare I say it, even Margaret Thatcher) could do.
DELEGATE!!!!!!!!!!!!! And put some faith in, show some trust in, and instil some ownership of the task to their more than capable subordinates.

Not shouting, just making the point. Salute
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24th

24th

Posts : 1849
Join date : 2009-03-25

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PostSubject: Re: Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison   Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison EmptySun Jan 12, 2014 11:55 am



Very simular investigation to Secrets of the Dead by Ian Knight!
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PostSubject: Re: Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison   Risking a Last Stand. Little Big Horn & Isandlwana Comparison Empty

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