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 Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.

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tasker224
Frank Allewell
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ADMIN

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyThu Oct 13, 2011 7:49 pm

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Once upon a time there was a visitor centre on top of Blacks Koppie.
This photos taken around the mid seventies. Its pretty good because of the way it shows the lack of development and encroachment in the area.

PS this is the place I once camped.
Photo By Forum Member Springbok
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24th

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyThu Oct 13, 2011 8:18 pm

Springbok. What happened to the Visitors center, and why was it removed.
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90th

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Isandlwana mid 70's   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyFri Oct 14, 2011 1:45 am

Hi 24th.
I remember reading about the visitor centre being there and being removed but for the life of me cant remember where
I saw it !. I'm sure Springbok will be able to fill us in . He may still be in NZ licking his wounds after loosing to the Aussies
last week in the W.C and the misery continued with the Aussies beating them in the opening 20 / 20 cricket match of
the Aussie tour of Sth Africa last night . ! :lol!: x many , many !
cheers 90th. Idea
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Frank Allewell

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyFri Oct 14, 2011 7:18 am

24th ( 90th shall be ignored)

Ken Gillings will probably be a better source of info but as far as i can remember the visitors centre was vandalised a lot and was eventually pulled down because of that.
When new it was a mine of information. Around the perimeter were the shields of all the regiments that took part. In the centre was a 3 dimentional diarama of the plain and the ridge. It had the positions of the regiments shown on the firing line and also a really graphic showing of the Impi's coming over the ridge. It gave a wonderful impression of the battle and being orientated to the plain it told the whole story really very well.
However in time the glass cases got smashed, the shields and ikua were stolen and the diarama was broken. It became a mess.
Thats when I believe that Amalpha decided to restore the battlefield and remove it.

Regards
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tasker224

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyFri Oct 14, 2011 7:09 pm

It would be interesting if someone could post up a more recent pic of the same view.
Visiting these sites is is on my to do list, I really must go.

90th, I have a feeling Aussie is going to beat Kiwi on sunday...they do not look as formidable without Dan Carter. How the Aussies beat SA last weekend I will never know; it is obvious Springbok is sick as a parrott...tis a bit soon for mickey taking ,90th. Do allow an appropriate period of mourning first!
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Younghusband

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyFri Oct 14, 2011 10:38 pm

tasker224 - one day, make the effort. My interest in the AZ conflict was reignited by a battlefield visit and, as many have stated before, the site at Isandhlwana is remarkably poignant. Years after my only visit I still feel humbled by what must have occured on that fateful day and I rmember feeling unnerved by the site.
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90th

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Isandlwana mid 70's   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyFri Oct 14, 2011 10:47 pm

Hi Tasker.
I did give him 5 days to recover , surely enough for a thick skinned springbok !. :lol!: :lol!: :lol!: .
cheers 90th. Idea
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Frank Allewell

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptySat Oct 15, 2011 9:47 am

Shocked Sniff Wink
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DundeeBoer

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptySat Oct 15, 2011 9:59 pm

90th, You might be remembering reading it in The Zulu War Then And Now ,by Ian Knight & Ian Castle. page 77 has almost the same picture as posted above and text about it being dismantled.

Here are some pictures on the battle plan Springbok mentioned. Sorry for the poor quality

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.][You must be registered and logged in to see this image.][You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I can't remember why I took this one but it's useful here. A view from the 24th monument back to Blacks' koppie. The blue arrow is a bit faint but it is about the position where the center stood. It is quite a bit higher than it looks here.
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Tasker, Jamie Stewarts' fantastic web site has great modern pictures and more. http://www.isandlwana1879.co.uk/index_files/Page7470.htm go to section three, general battlefield, picture 8 of 9 for almost the same view as the Black and white picture in the first post of this thread. I believe Jamie is a member of this forum as well.


Hope these are of interest.
Regards, Jeff

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24th

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptySat Oct 15, 2011 10:36 pm

Excellent. First time I have seen a photo, that's gives me some idea of where we were.
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90th

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Isandlwana mid 70's   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptySun Oct 16, 2011 7:01 am

Hi DundeeBoer.
Thanks for the info , I knew I'd seen it somewhere . I have that many books I didnt want to launch an expedition to find it .
I went and had a look and yes , its very similar to the one my mate Springbok posted .
cheers 90th. Idea
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tasker224

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptySun Oct 16, 2011 6:59 pm

DundeeBoer, many thanks indeed for the link, some really beautiful photos.
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Frank Allewell

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyMon Oct 17, 2011 7:06 am

Dundee
Brilliant Ive been trying to find my old photos of the diorama. Yours show exactly how informative it was. To be able to stand behind it and compare it with the battlefield was brilliant, its really sad that it doesnt still exist.

Regards
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24th

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyMon Oct 17, 2011 8:20 am

When the Visitors centre was in-place were there any constraints, regarding the taking of artifacts from the Battlefield, or was it included the your visit, what you found you kept. Also was there an exhibition in the centre relating to the Zulu war in general, and lastly, does any photos exist of the interior of the centre.
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Frank Allewell

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyMon Oct 17, 2011 8:49 am

24th
The visitors centre was an open structure, the rear and only wall held a series of glass cases that contained the shields of all the regiments that took part. The roof was almost like a wing, low at the rear and high opening onto the battlefield.
In the centre was a diarama, probably around ( going from memory ) 1.2 m or 4 foot diameter, set at waist hieght. It was orientated exactly to the battlefield so by looking at it and galancing up it was able to convey extremely accuratly the whole battle. Really brilliantly done.
I was fortunate to see it in all its glory, however a subsequent visit a matter of a year latre saw the glass caese shattered and the shields missing. The diarama had been damaged quite badly. It had become quite an eyesore.
At that time the battlefield was unfenced and had no security so any artifacts found were 'fair game'. The local children made pocket money selling artifacts to the tourists. However Im sure that there are many many people around the world with bits of rusty old baked bean tins that are positive the got an absolute bargain of an antique. There were original artifacts to be had from the locals, the youngsters when pressed, in particular in Zulu or Africaans would bring out the genuine articles, shell casings etc. I bought a cap badge and a broken bayonet and many rounds of ammunition ( THESE ARE NOW IN A MUSEUM).
The photos posted by Dundee Boer are of the diarama itself, I will try and find photos that I took at the time. I have no doubt that Ken Gillings will have then by the thousand.
There is a new visitors centre in the village adjacent to the mission church, it has a more modern type display section with some horrendous errors in the story boards. Its not the same..
Regards
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Neil Aspinshaw

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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyMon Oct 17, 2011 9:17 am

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The concrete base is still in situ. This is a picture I took in March, twenty meters behind and at one o'clock from the bus you can see the black spot, with path leading to it (refuse bin!) a third the way up Malhabamknosi
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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyFri Dec 23, 2011 1:19 pm

Apologies for the long delay in respoinding to this. I have only just seen it.
I vaguely remember being told in the 1970s that the then KwaZulu Monuments Council decided to dismantle the diarama because it was felt that it impacted on the battlefield. I persuaded my father to drive me to the unveiling - it was in July 1964 - when several VIPs attended (one I recall was Inspector Fairlie and another Colonel Clarke) and the Natal Carbineers provided the trumpeters. It was a freezing cold day. Several direct descendants of both Zulu and Colonial participants in the battle were also present. It was the first time that I met Mnandi kaMehlokazulu (Mehlokazulu kaSihayo's son). The structure was unveiled by Mr Mervyn Wood MEC. George Chadwick was the MC.
The structure - when viewed from above - was supposed to resemble the wings of an angel. The actual model was, in my opinion, outstanding. There were several relics from the battle on display as well as many shields representing the ilibutho involved in the attack. I believe that the model itself is still in existence but I don't know where it is. I'll try to find out.
Several battlefield guides use the base to tell their story, as it is a good vantage point especially if you have elderly people with you.
In those days, too, abafana used to sell 'relics', ranging from genuine cartridge cases, buttons, bullets, shell fragments etc, to modern SA Railways buttons that they had blackened or scratched to appear old! Unfortunately, as interest in the battle grew, so did the demand for relics, resulting in cairns being ripped apart.
Incidentally, the dispositions of the various Companies and other formations were indicated by yellow painted Concrete blocks, with a plaque affixed to them. Smaller concrete markers embedded into the soil were more specific, and several of the latter may still be seen on the site of the final deployment. The big markers have recently been used as a wall where the new parking site is at McKenzie College.
Regards, Ken
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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyFri Dec 23, 2011 2:49 pm

There are 2 of the small concrete stands still there. One is down by the old road and trading store, Reads: Durnfords Donga. The other is on the mountain reads: Younghusbands last stand. They used to be all over the battlefield and the ridge above.

Regards
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Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Isandlwana Photo Mid Seventies.   Isandlwana Photo  Mid Seventies. EmptyWed Jan 25, 2012 1:29 pm

This is a quite photographer...
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