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 Lieutenant Clark, Durnford

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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySat Jan 31, 2015 1:13 pm

Hi, thanks for the acceptance. I am Col Anthony Durnford's 2nd cousin*3. and a family history researcher and writer within our extended family.

There was another at the Battle, Lieutenant Clark Durnford of Natal Native Horse, would anyone have any information about him. I tend to think Clark may be his second name
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySat Jan 31, 2015 1:17 pm

Hi Kris,


Neil here (from the FB group)

Welcome aboard.

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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySat Jan 31, 2015 3:11 pm

krish wrote:
Hi, thanks for the acceptance. I am Col Anthony Durnford's 2nd cousin*3. and a family history researcher and writer within our extended family.    

There was another at the Battle, Lieutenant Clark Durnford  of Natal Native Horse, would anyone have any information about him.  I tend to think Clark may be his second name

Thames Advertiser, Volume XII, Issue 3257, 5 March 1879, Page 3

"THE ZULU WAR.

The following particulars are in addition to those published from late papers: by the' Garonne.' Subjoined are the names of those who were missing up to January 25 from Rorke's Drifti- Natal Carbineers.-Lieuteo.ant Scott, Quartermaster London, Quartermaster- Sergeant Bullook, Trumpeter Jaokson, Troopers Blacket, flaldane, Boram, Dean, Boss, Swift, Dumley, MoLery, Davis, Hawkins, T.Taborton, Christian, Mayboe, H. Dickinson, M. Moode, K. Jackson, Mendenwell, Whitelaw, 0. Fletcher, and Muirhead. Newcastle Mounted Rifles.-Captain Bradstreet, Quartermaster Hitchcock, and eleven non-commissioned officers and men. Buffalo Border Guard.-Quartermaster McPhail and seven non-commissioned officers. .Natal Mounted Police.—Tliirty-ono non-commissioned officers and men. l-24th Regiment.—Kvb Companies.— Colonel Pulleine, Major Blaok, Captains Degacher, Wardell, Moystyn, and Young, husband; Lieutenants Cavye.Hodson, Atkinson, Daly, Ansty, Dyson, and Porteus j Adjutants Melville, F. N. Melville. Doubtful, Quartermaster Pullen. 2-2<Uh Begiment.-One Company.— Lieutenants Pope, Austin, Dyer, Griffith, and Quartermaster Bloomfield. This company was on picket duty at the time, of the attack, and had been overlooked in the official reports. .., Royal Artillery.—sth Brigade, N Battery, Captain Stuart Smith, two guns, both spiked. Captain Smith was assaigaied while spiking the second gun. [Mr Curling was encamped, but escaped.] Captain Bussell, Rocket Battery. Boyal Engineers.-Colonel Durnford, Captain George Shepstone (?), Lieutenant Macdonald. Surgeon-Major Shepherd, Lieutenant Coghill, A.D.C., Lieutenant Roberts, Native Horse Contingent, and Lieutenant Clark, Durnford, ditto. _ 3-lst Begiment Natal Native Contingent.—Captains Erohn, J. Lonsdale, Murray, Barry, and Erskine; Lieutenants Hon. Vereker, Gibson, MoOormiok, Hoicroft, Avery, Jameson, Rivers (?), and Young; Quartermaster Chambers, Assistant-surgeon Bruce, and Grant, political agent"
TEXT AS PER WEBSITE
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySat Jan 31, 2015 10:18 pm

[quote="nthornton1979"]Hi Kris,


Neil here (from the FB group)

Welcome aboard.

[Thanks Neil ]
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90th

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PostSubject: Merge with Krish   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySun Feb 01, 2015 4:37 am

Hi Krish
If you see Littlehands Post there is a comma after Clark , I doubt Clarke Durnford actually existed in the zulu war in any case ! . Shocked I've checked the rolls of all the units with  ' Natal ' in the title , no mention of a Lt Clarke Durnford or any Lt with the name Clark or Durnford .
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySun Feb 01, 2015 10:12 pm

Thank you so much for looking for me. I have the list of the dead which was reported in so many newspapers in UK, and even in my part of the world almost every paper ran the list, obviously there was a mistake, and that is why I couldn't find him either. But coincidentally Clark Durnford features in our lineage. I guess not nice for families to read not only about one close relation but two, to die in the same battle. I also wondered why nobody had made mention of it either considering what followed.
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PostSubject: New Members Welcome   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySun Feb 01, 2015 10:24 pm

Hi Krish
It's a little strange , as I said , I couldnt find anyone by that name on the actual medal roll's , let alone being KIA in the same battle , I'm afraid I've never heard of a Lt Clark Durnford , what sort of relation was he to Anthony & Edward ? . I've read Edward's book ( A Soldiers Life And Work In Sth Africa ) , which is partly based on Anthony's diary notes and letters , I cant recall a Clark Durnford being mentioned . I'll have a quick look again .
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PostSubject: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySun Feb 01, 2015 11:05 pm

Thank you I cannot find someone his name or agegroup either. Clarke Durnford was Anthony's 2nd great grand uncle , his g grandfather Col Andrew Durnford brother. Of the 4 boys 3 were at RE college, and served, Clark worked there, he had 2 sons who also were in RE. His grandsons were also in RE. I thought that Clark might have been his grandson but couldn't link him. As was the habit each generation named their children the same which has caused difficulty for many people trying to work out who was who. There are also at least two distinct lineages, ours from a William, the other from Richard. Then later in the 1800 the two merged through a marriage. Our g.grandfather had 17 children 3 wives, and was I think in his 60' when Montagu was born, hence the few Australian cousins are still alive and kicking !
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PostSubject: lLt Clarke Durnford    Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptySun Feb 01, 2015 11:41 pm

Hi Krish
I've gone through Anthony's letters to his mother in his book I mentioned earlier , and there is no mention of a relative being with Anthony's No2 Column , or any mention whatsoever of a Clark Durnford , I do find it difficult to believe he was present at Isandlwana , or even involved in the campaign for that matter , I've read many books regarding the war , and I'm at a loss to explain an individual by the name of Clark Durnford , whom to me , has never been mentioned !!. scratch .
90th Shocked Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 12:06 am

This is the only "Clark Durnford" I could find.

"CLARK DURNFORD, b. Jul 24, 1748, London, England; m. MARY BASKERVILLE. More About CLARK DURNFORD: Burial: Aug 21, 1808, Kensington, England'

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PostSubject: Lt Clark Durnford !!!!    Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 12:09 am

Thanks 24th , that would make him a ripe old age to have been KIA at Isandlwana ? scratch scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 12:26 am

He also had a son Clark he did very well for himself living around the corner from Kensington Palace. This son had two sons Thomas Elias and I think George who was a career soldier with no children so my assumption was that somewhere we ad missed another another of Thomas children, which would have been the correct age. I appreciate your help.
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90th

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PostSubject: Lt Clark, Durnford    Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 12:35 am

Happy to try and help , and solve a mystery here and there , with some luck , and help from others on the Forum .
90th You need to study mo
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 8:37 am

24th wrote:
This is the only "Clark Durnford" I could find.

"CLARK DURNFORD, b. Jul 24, 1748, London, England; m. MARY BASKERVILLE. More About CLARK DURNFORD: Burial: Aug 21, 1808, Kensington, England'


I wonder if Mary owned a " Hound"
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 9:36 am

Actually her family were watchmakers and Clark also ran a fine China business with Bow China so there may have been some amongst the collection.
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 10:27 am

The hound of the BASKERVILLE's

Good film.
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 11:08 am

Major George Augustus Durnford 27th Foot (son of Clark Durnford) South Africa medal 1834 - 53.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Also received Indian Mutiny medal.

Steve
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 11:26 am

The 'Baskerville Hall' used in the film, was actually a railway hotel built by the gwr Shocked .

Not a lot of people know that. Very Happy

The 27th was raised in Ireland (Enniskillen), in 1689 to fight against King James ll, they fought alongside King Billy at the battle of the Boyne. agree


Last edited by Mr M. Cooper on Mon Feb 02, 2015 11:32 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 11:29 am

Joseph Clark Durnford (son of Clark Durnford) born July 1774, died April 1853. Lived at 11 Phillimore Gardens near Kensington Palace.

Steve
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 10:13 pm

George was indeed well decorated and lived in Bath, Anthony's uncle George had Fort Port Durnford named after him, as he died there around 1853 I think, if you are interested they are all in my family blog, with as much as I have been able to research. and if anyone can help with discoveries all the better. Clark's sons inherited wealth from his estate he owned many properties in London. Richest street in London 1912 Frances Rupp Anthony's daughter was living at No 11. We were on King James side through our great uncle Sir Michael Creagh! He had been LM of Dublin and then fought on James' s team, before fleeing to France probably with the LG chain, in fact King James made Michael ' s brother Sir William Creagh Lord Mayor of Newcastle . Our lineage is through him. Do you see why I started to write our family history from King William, the stories were just so interesting. Sorry that was a bit long winded. Kris
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyMon Feb 02, 2015 10:51 pm

90th wrote:
Happy to try and help , and solve a mystery here and there , with some luck , and help from others on the Forum .
90th You need to study mo
Thank you wonder if you could msg me please as, I am unable topen msg as yet
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PostSubject: Lt Clark Durnford    Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 2:21 am

Hi Krish
Port Durnford I'm sure was never a Fort , and I dont think it was named after Anthony's uncle either ! , no-one died there in 1853 ,as it didnt exist until the AZW of 1879 ! .
90th Shocked
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Lieutenant Clark, Durnford Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 7:56 am

Port Durnford and Point Durnford have been around for a lot longer than we think. As 90th says it was used and developed by the men of HMS Shar during the war. But the earliest mention is in PE Rapers Dictionary of South African Place names: The port. was named after Midshipman Durnford who accompanied Captain WF Owen in 1822 in the coastal exploration by the British survey ships, Barracouta and Leven. Point Durnford is credired to Captain Durnford of the 27th Regiment who was sent from Algoa Bay with a force of 100 men to assist Captain Smith besieged at Congella in 1842.
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PostSubject: Lt Clark Durnford    Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 10:34 am

I had misread the journal I was going to quote so I've deleted my post .
90th


Last edited by 90th on Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:53 am; edited 1 time in total
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90th

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PostSubject: Lt Clarke Durnford    Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 10:45 am

Here's what I quoted .

http://samilitaryhistory.org/82/82junnl.html

90th
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PostSubject: Lt Clark Durnford    Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 10:48 am

Ah the penny has dropped , the page is talking of the two different Durnford's .
90th
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 10:59 am

Frank Allewell wrote:
Port Durnford and Point Durnford have been around for a lot longer than we think. As 90th says it was used and developed by the men of HMS Shar during the war. But the earliest mention is in PE Rapers Dictionary of South African Place names: The port. was named after Midshipman Durnford who accompanied Captain WF Owen in 1822 in the coastal exploration by the British survey ships, Barracouta and Leven. Point Durnford is credired to Captain Durnford of the 27th Regiment who was sent from Algoa Bay with a force of 100 men to assist Captain Smith besieged at Congella in 1842.



My goodness you are clever thank you so much,  Midshipman Durnford is Edward Philip Durnford, and he was th principal hydrographer (if that is how it is said), he was on the Levin, and he died of diptheria or similar, at midnight on 14 Aug 1824, he was buried at sea, near a coral reef somewhere outside of Madagascar.  Captain Owen names a bay and I think perhaps a coral cay after him, but I could never find the places.  He was 21, and my 2nd great uncle.  So thank you for that information.   He is then Anthony's first cousin.  So much appreciated.

The Point Durnford was somewhere near Emtonjaneni (Mtonjaneni maybe now) and I know why I should answer every email on my PC not a tablet because I remember trying to find it and while google maps acknowledges it as Point Durnford is seems to then call it Port Durnford, but George was ill somewhere near there and had to rest, he later died in Simla.  The 27th built Fort Napier, and George was perhaps the first magistrate there.   The Battle was Congella, he then later was in the 45th Foot.  Thankyou everyone so much.
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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 11:04 am

90th wrote:
Ah the penny has dropped , the page is talking of the two different Durnford's .
90th

Don't worry there were heaps of them in Africa/India/Ceylon/China/the only way to work them all out is to have the genealogy open at the same time and worse still often they are referred to as Major or General or Colonel and that makes it doubly hard, cause they neary all wore those titles. - I appreciate that you have taken the time to look.
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Frank Allewell

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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 11:16 am

Some info on Fort Napier PMB
Lieutenant Gibb began construction work at Fort Napier on 1 September 1843, the day after the troops arrived. Barracks were traced out in the shape of a square to provide accommodation for 200 troops from the 45th Regiment, the men of the Royal Artillery, the cavalrymen of the Cape Mounted Rifles and their supporting storemen, cooks, farriers and stable hands. Stone emplacements at opposite ends of the square were constructed first, but work was delayed by heavy rains. The troops had to live in tents for months on end while the officers occupied houses nearby in Loop and Longmarket Streets.

By July 1845 the brick barracks had been completed. The outer walls were loopholed and windowless , while the inner walls that faced the square had windows. On the eastern and western corners were redoubts, mounting three guns on revolving platforms which completely commanded the town. The headquarters of the 45th Regiment moved from Cape Town to Pietermaritzburg during 1845 and the Commanding Officer, Lieutenant Colonel Boys, was appointed commandant of Natal and a member of the Executive Council, and instructed to act as head of the Government in the absence of Lieutenant Governor Martin West.

The garrison at Fort Napier played a critical role in changing Pietermaritzburg from a Voortrekker dorp to a firmly Anglophile Victorian colonial capital. Many of the cultural and social amenities were started by the officers while the other ranks laboured to build a new city. The Government School, used in 1856 for the first meeting of the Legislative Council, was built by two soldiers of the garrison, McKeaney and Murphy. The men of the 45th Regiment, the Royal Engineers, the Royal Artillery and the Cape Mounted Rifles improved and built Pietermaritzburg's water furrows, roads, offices and private houses. The Durban detachment of the 45th Regiment built the 45th Cutting which remained the western entrance to the port city for well over a century. The 45th Regiment left Pietermaritzburg in 1859, but many of the men who completed their period of military service during the Regiment's fifteen-year stay elected to remain in the City as colonists. One such veteran, Thomas Greene, who had arrived in 1843, described the 45th Regiment as the 'real pioneers' of the Colony. Although poorly clothed and fed they were 'ready and willing' to do 'every work that came their way'.
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Frank Allewell

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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 11:17 am

90th
Surprised me as well, had no idea the name went that far back.

Cheers
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90th

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PostSubject: Lt Clark Durnford    Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 11:50 am

Hi Springy
Amazing what can be traced back along a families line isnt it , especially one which seems to be synonymous with Sth Africa !
The Durnford name has quite a deal to do with Sth Africa it seems ! . Shocked
90th Very Happy
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Frank Allewell

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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 3:18 pm

Hi 90th
I wonder what else we can blame them for? Very Happy
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Chelmsfordthescapegoat

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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyTue Feb 03, 2015 7:08 pm

Accused or blamed?
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old historian2

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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyThu Feb 05, 2015 11:06 am

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krish




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PostSubject: Re: Lieutenant Clark, Durnford   Lieutenant Clark, Durnford EmptyThu Feb 05, 2015 10:05 pm

old historian2 wrote:
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He was at that, as nearly all the Isaacson lineage through the Durnford family were involved in some way or other from mid 1700's, in either RE or other branches of the military.
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