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 Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders

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xhosa2000
forlornhope76
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forlornhope76




Posts : 10
Join date : 2013-12-13

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyWed Nov 02, 2016 11:56 am

Greetings,
Does anyone know or can anyone point me in the right direction as to who the commanders of A, B and C troop Frontier Light Horse were?

I've trawled the internet but haven't found anything so far other than that Capt Barton may have lead one troop before promotion to command the regiment.

Thanks
FH
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xhosa2000

xhosa2000


Posts : 1186
Join date : 2015-11-24

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyWed Nov 02, 2016 7:41 pm

Hi forlornhope76, have you heard of Terry Sole's excellent work
For God, Queen and Colony, its a very informative reference tool.
A Troop consisted of a Captain, two Lieutenent's, one Troop Sgt
Major, two Sergeant's, and three Corporal's and Sixty men..

Redver's Buller was in overall command, Barton second, and near
the end of the Zulu war D'Arcy took over but Buller always consid-
ered it his command and regained it for the final push at Ulundi..

I know you want the breakdown of command regarding Troop's A, B,
C, and D?.. but the best i can do is to scan the medal roll which will
give you the names of the officers.. cheers xhosa
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John Young

John Young


Posts : 2420
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Location : Слава Україні! Героям слава!

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyWed Nov 02, 2016 8:14 pm

Forlornhope76,

As Les correctly points out a captain commanded a troop.

The Frontier Light Horse's captains were: J. H. Berry; Arthur Blaine (promoted post-Hlobane); Henry Cecil Dudgeon D'Arcy; Howard Hutton (Paymaster rather than a Troop Commander.); A. C. Oldham.

I have discounted H. A. Jenner who did not serve in the Zulu War, nor have I included Wyatt Whalley who left the Frontier Light Horse to form the Natal Light Horse.

Lieutenant & Captain Robert Johnston Barton, 1st Battalion, Coldstream Guards certainly held a troop command, prior to Buller's elevation. Barton had cavalry experience having served in the 9th Lancers from 1866 until transferring to the Coldstream Guards in 1874.

I may have the answer in Hutton's journal of 1879, but it is currently on loan to another forum member.

John Y.
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forlornhope76




Posts : 10
Join date : 2013-12-13

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 7:48 am

Dear Xhosa and John

thanks for the replies. I have indeed come across Terry Sole's book in references but haven't yet found it available on amazon.
If you can look through the medal roll to confirm the names that would be much appreciated but only if it is easy don't put yourself out on my account. Also John lists the captains in his answer so perhaps that is all I need?
Many thanks
FH
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Saul David 1879




Posts : 527
Join date : 2009-02-28

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 9:49 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
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forlornhope76




Posts : 10
Join date : 2013-12-13

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 11:11 am

Aah of course other good book retailers are available Wink Thank you Mr David!
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xhosa2000

xhosa2000


Posts : 1186
Join date : 2015-11-24

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 3:07 pm

No prob's FH..here is the first page of the medal roll listing officers.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
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John Young

John Young


Posts : 2420
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horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 4:05 pm

Les,

I don't know who compiled the typed roll that Terry Sole published in his book, but they obviously had little or no knowledge of the Frontier Light Horse..

H. Cecil D. D'Arcy, V.C. has become 'Captain Ditrey, C., V.C.' There are other errors relating to the Frontier Light Horse contained in the chapter.

John Y.
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rusteze

rusteze


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horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 6:11 pm

Here are the first two pages of the roll at Kew. Looks like the originator made the errors.
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Steve
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xhosa2000

xhosa2000


Posts : 1186
Join date : 2015-11-24

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 7:15 pm

Agreed JY!, but with the absence of anything better, and the fact
that all the colonial records were destroyed and indeed burned
deliberately... what a gross error of judgement.. it's as well we
have people like you around.
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John Young

John Young


Posts : 2420
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Location : Слава Україні! Героям слава!

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 8:33 pm

Steve,

Have you noticed that the Frontier Light Horse's roll is the only one - to my knowledge - that purports to be contemporary that is typed?

Who with any knowledge of that unit would compiling it in Aldershot in 1880? The only contenders to my mind would have been Buller or Howard Hutton.

To me it looks just like the earlier efforts of D. R. Forsyth.

John Y.
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rusteze

rusteze


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horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyThu Nov 03, 2016 9:08 pm

John

There are 631 pages of colonial unit rolls and they are a real hotchpotch.
There are a few odds and sods for the FLH like this one, which looks authentic.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

This one for the NMP looks very much like the FLH typed sheets.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

And there are lots of contemporary printed rolls (not typed). But I take your point about Forsyth.

Steve
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forlornhope76




Posts : 10
Join date : 2013-12-13

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyFri Nov 04, 2016 7:29 am

Thank you Xhosa much appreciated. Now my miniatures can go into battle anonymous no longer!
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xhosa2000

xhosa2000


Posts : 1186
Join date : 2015-11-24

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptyFri Nov 04, 2016 11:48 am

No worry's FH.. JY and Rusteze have a much better handle on things than me,
but we all seem to get there in the end..maybe you could post some images
when you have completed your project..have fun. cheers xhosa
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cam simpson




Posts : 90
Join date : 2014-10-10

horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders Empty
PostSubject: Re: Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders   horse - Frontier Light Horse Troop Commanders EmptySat Nov 12, 2016 5:46 am

John, I agree the Roll would have been based on Buller and Hutton's input. I've often wondered if the original is it Downes House with Buller's records.

Forlonrhope, Regarding the Troops and Troop Commanders the actual Troop Composition fluctuated between two to four during the regiments lifespan (1877 - 1880). It was cut from four to three troops before Hlobane although George Mossop says they were in four 'companies' at Hlobane (They only had three troops at Hlobane). At the end of the war they had just two troops in the field and in late September when the pacification operations concluded they were immanently about to be disbanded but a last minute reprieve found '100 Hand picked' men in two troops under H.C.D. D'Arcy VC bound for Middleburg during the Boer disturbances in that town. These disturbances were just prior to the Second Anglo-Pedi (Sekhukhune) War. Sadly the '100 Hand Picked' men as they were known were returned to Pietermaritzburg in January 1880 and disbanded without any form of muster parade or form of recognition in the last week of that month.

The Troop Commanders likewise moved around and to add to John's list, Captain F.H. Berry and two British Officers, Captain H.M.E. Brunkner and J.E.H. Prior commanded Troops at different periods. Brunkner's command was not a success and he was later temporarily moved to Woods Irregulars before being sent to Durban. Prior was a success but his regiment needed him back and later in the campaign he served alongside the FLH in the Flying Column. One other man, Captain J O'Neill (Sometimes spelt O'Neil) and formerly of the Albany Rangers joined the FLH at Khambula camp with a recruit draft from the Eastern Cape but he doesn't seem to have fitted in with Buller and he moved onto the Transvaal where he offered his services. I've found no evidence of him commanding a Troop apart from the recruits.


Cam.
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