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 Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments

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90th
John Young
handja21
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handja21




Posts : 5
Join date : 2017-10-21

horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptySat Apr 21, 2018 11:16 am

Isandlwana | Inhlobane 1879

Is anyone able to advise where to source the Attestation papers of those killed in action in the abovementioned battles with special reference to the Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments? I have one John Davey/Davie/Davy in both regiments that may match my great Grandfather? Your assistance would be much appreciated.

Thank you
Janice Hand (nee Davy)
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John Young

John Young


Posts : 2422
Join date : 2013-09-08
Age : 66
Location : Слава Україні! Героям слава!

horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptySat Apr 21, 2018 3:48 pm

Janice,

The trooper who died at Hlobane, appears on a number of contemporary rolls as John Darcy, a Scot, who enlisted in the Border Horse in Pretoria. I assume the late Terry Sole, corrected the name to Davey in his work For God, Queen & Colony, but does not cite a reason or source.

The C.M.R. did not serve in the Zulu War, although I vaguely recall a reference to a iSandlwana casualty as being late of the C.M.R. The Cape Mounted Rifles had two incarnations, the first a British-raised unit which disbanded in 1870, the second in 1878 as a Cape Colony unit mainly from men who had formally served in the Frontier Armed & Mounted Police.

Sorry not a lot of help to you.

JY

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90th

90th


Posts : 10468
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 66
Location : Melbourne, Australia

horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Border Horse & CMY   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptySun Apr 22, 2018 1:15 am

Hi Handja21
I seem to recall that all the service papers of those KIA at Isandlwana ( and other places ) were destroyed and removed from the said Regimental Records. All the Colonial Records from the Zulu War that were stored in England , were Pulped as part of the War effort in 1915 ! . Happy to be corrected .
90th Sad Sad
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ymob

ymob


Posts : 2268
Join date : 2010-10-22
Location : France

horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptySun Apr 22, 2018 6:50 am

Hi,
I wonder if there is a link between Davey, adjudant of the Volunteers (central column) during the first invasion and John Davey/Davy. ..
C heers
Frederic
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handja21




Posts : 5
Join date : 2017-10-21

horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptySun Apr 22, 2018 1:22 pm

Thank you all for your replies. I will follow up on these pointers and hopefully make some progress. It appears that John Davey of CMR'S definitely was kia in the Zulu War 1879 as I have the medal record in my saved items on this site. I also have a letter to the Colonial Secretary stating that 'he had a commission in the army and had applied to be gazetted out shortly and would like to join the CMR's'. The address on his application letter was Kilkonnel Ireland. I found the latter in the SA Records Office in Cape Town. Your information about the regiment is correct in that there were changes to the regiment/name more than once in it's history.
Thank you once again for your kind assistance.

Kind regards
Janice 'handja21'

PS Do you know of a Susan Price at all? I have a very brief email to get in touch with her.
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John Young

John Young


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horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptySun Apr 22, 2018 6:57 pm

Janice,

Looking on the forum search it was 90th that gave that answer based on the research of Terry Sole, that I mentioned above.

Fred’,

I considered N. E. Davey as well.

JY
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ymob

ymob


Posts : 2268
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horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptyMon Apr 23, 2018 12:39 pm

Bonjour John,
I know that you have a deep knowledge in the Volunteers' Troops. Wink
Kind regards.
Fred
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handja21




Posts : 5
Join date : 2017-10-21

horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptySun May 13, 2018 12:33 pm

Thank you both for your assistance - it is much appreciated!
Kino regards
Janice
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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Join date : 2015-12-27
Location : Victorian London

horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptyMon Oct 01, 2018 2:30 pm

John Young wrote:
Janice,



The C.M.R. did not serve in the Zulu War.  The Cape Mounted Rifles had two incarnations, the first a British-raised unit which disbanded in 1870, the second in 1878 as a Cape Colony unit mainly from men who had formally served in the Frontier Armed & Mounted Police.



Please forgive my ignorance, but I'm trying to get my head round who and what the CMR actually did and when?

So they didn't serve during the 1879 "Zulu War" per say. But were active during 1879 elsewhere? They were a sort of para-military police force during war, but during peace time were policemen? So an example which had the 77-8-9 clasp is likely to be to a chap who had previously served in the Frontier Armed & Mounted Police?



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Brett Hendey

Brett Hendey


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Location : Kloof, KZN

horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptyMon Oct 01, 2018 3:06 pm

Tylden's history of "The Armed Forces of South Africa 1659 - 1954' records the CMR (Colonial) as follows:
1855 - Raised as the FAMP
1878 - Became the CMR (Colonial)
1913 - Became the 1st Regiment SAMR
1926 - Disbanded.
Even as the CMR and SAMR, it remained a paramilitary police force.

It is not to be confused with the CMR (Imperial), which had several incarnations before becoming the CMR in 1827. Initially it had British officers and Hottentot (Khoi) other ranks, but the latter became increasingly mixed race. It served in the Cape Frontier Wars up to the one that ended in 1853, and it was disbanded in 1870.

Brett
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Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


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horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptyMon Oct 01, 2018 3:27 pm

Victorian Dad
This is an extract from some research done a number of years ago on a survivor from the hospital at RD.
It may answer a couple of your questions.


However by 1877, 18 year old Jesse was living in Capetown and is known to have joined the Frontier Armed and Mounted Police, (later to be renamed the Cape Mounted Rifles). He was posted to No. 7 Troop and served with them during the Eastern Frontier Campaigns of 1877/78. Mayor was entitled to the South Africa Medal with clasp for 1877-78 and is named in the medal roll as "Private Jesse Mayor," This medal was issued on 2/5/1884 [National Archives, Kew: WO100/47]
At the close of hostilities against the Xhosa, Mayor, like many men from the Colonial units, was tempted by the offer of further military action against the Zulu and in November 1878 he joined the Royal Swazi Levy in Kingwilliamstown.

Cheers
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


Posts : 41
Join date : 2015-12-27
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horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments Empty
PostSubject: Re: Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments   horse - Border Horse and Cape Mounted Rifles regiments EmptyMon Oct 01, 2018 5:51 pm

Many thanks Brett & Frank.
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