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 Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?

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PostSubject: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Sun Oct 23, 2011 2:59 pm

I remember reading that his brothers went to identify and collect his body for burial. Did they take him back to Fort Napier cemetery ? Additionally, although asked before elsewhere ages ago, is or was there such a thing as a Visitors' Book for Fort Napier cemetery, perhaps now archived somewhere, or more sadly lost ?
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Drummer Boy 14

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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Sun Oct 23, 2011 4:32 pm

Colin J

i Dont know where he know rests but some infomation that may help.

His body was found near Durnford and 14 other Carbineers at the foot of the Stonny Koppie, he had hardly decayed at all because he was sheltered partly under a wagon.

Please look at bold text, this is the recovery of Durnfords body.

"The funeral was held on Sunday afternoon, 12 October 1879, attended by well over 1,500 military personnel, together with a great number of the PMB civilian population.
In early October 1879, Jabez Molife, (although his signature reflects Mulipe) was sent to the battlefield, possibly by Bishop Colenso, to bring the body of the gallant Colonel back to Pietermaritzburg. This he did by ambulance, arriving in PMB on Thursday 9 Octobert. Lt. Scott's two brothers, on a similar mission at Isandlwana, assisted Jabez in the exhumation of Durnford's body.When the ambulance reached Greytown, Jabez wrote to the Bishop in a letter dated 7 October..An extract ran:
" He [Durnford} said, ' Jabez, if it gets worse here in Natal, so that I die, it will be well that Hlubi's people and the Edendale men should be there when I am buried.' But we were just speaking jestingly, though I remember his words today; for I could see that his heart did not think of mr as a black man; but that was his way with all natives."
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:04 pm

Thanks DB14. I'd really like to know where Lt. Scott was buried, as I don't think his body remained on the battlefield, but was also transferred back to Fort Napier. I've not seen any further info or photos of where his last resting place is. I was supplied with an e-mail contact address a couple of years ago, of someone who is, or at least was, a caretaker/warden of Fort Napier, who may have known where any of the cemetery's records were kept, but I lost the details before sending an enquiry due to my computer crashing.
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:07 pm

Hi Colin J

Scroll down a bit a member posted a number to ring i think about Fort Napier or something.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Cheers DB14
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Oct 27, 2011 7:46 pm

DB14, my apologies. I missed your answer even though it was on a topic I actually started. scratch I've checked the link and it appears Ken Gillings may have the answers I seek. I'd better start a new topic in case he misses my question on this. I'll not phone him though. Thankyou.
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:27 pm

Hi Colin

Just been sent this from W.F Jacksons book on Isandlwana.

It confirms that the Natal Men that could be reconized had there name
wrote on there graves. Scott was reconized so his body could well have been removed.

Here it is

"The Natal men found near him (meaning Durnford)were covered over with stones
and their names written in pencil on nearby stones or pieces of wood"

Cheers
DB14
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:04 pm

DB14, thanks. I do recall initially they were buried, or at least covered over, but unfortunately, many of the names faded or washed off, before the return of the burial parties. However, Trooper Blaikie, I seem to recall, even then, was recognised by a relative, so was buried where he lay and his grave was marked, and still is today.
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:26 pm

Col. Durnford was wrapped in a waterproof sheet and buried in the side of a nearby donga.
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Nov 03, 2011 4:27 pm

Also a spade was put on to mark the grave of Durnford Idea

Cheers
DB14
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PostSubject: Last resting place of Durnford   Fri Nov 04, 2011 3:54 pm

Hi DB14,
As Durnford was reportedly linked to one of the Colenso sisters, who were the daughters of the renegade Bishop Colenso , Bishop of Natal , I hardly think that his earthly remains were not repatriated to Pietermaritzburg for a proper christian burial.
In one of the twists of this time, the good Bishop was very much anti-Britain and "for" the Zulu's, yet Col Durnford was havinga tete-a-tete with one of the Bishops daughters all of whom were original 5th columists and gave the colonial authorites many headaches. After the authorities had received repeated complaints about Bishop Colenso's errant behaviour, which they felt was rocking the boat, he was defrocked and sent back to England. He had however been warned to shape up or ship out, many times before the defrocking.
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Fri Nov 04, 2011 5:48 pm

Barry, an interesting post. I've heard of '5th columnists' before, but not within the context of the Zulu War, about the Colenso family. That said, I do know the Bishop was quite outspoken, but Durnford's relationship with Nell was of friendship. I got the impression, though haven't pursued it a great deal, that the Bishop started questioning religion and other matters, when asked for answers by members of native tribes about aspects on the bible - please correct me on this if I am wrong. There was, I felt, on his part, a great deal of disappointment with the British and/or Colonial Governments. I was interested enough in him, to consider getting the book The Heretic, but haven't yet. Although I have very little knowledge of him, I got the notion that he was ahead of his time, sort of, looking outside of the box. My conclusions are probably quite naive, due to my lack of knowledge on this matter, but I'd be interested to hear any more thoughts by yourself, regarding Bishop Colenso.
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PostSubject: The Colenso sisters   Fri Nov 04, 2011 6:32 pm

Hi Colin J,
I have not gone too much into the political issues around the Colenso's because that may be seen as taking sides, which I am not. Indeed some of the issues raised by the Colenso's were VERY valid, but remembering too that the Natal Colonists in 1878/79 slept fearfully, armed and in laagers most nights, they did not see it that way at all !.
The Colenso's were as a result hot potatoes and definitely "persona non grata" .
I regret to say that a distant relative , a spinster, Kate Giles, was one of their cohorts and caused my family great embarrasment at the time over their anti British stance.
Anyway, if you can lay your hands on a copy of "Colenso Letters from Natal", by Wyn Rees, ( Published by Shuter and Shooter in Pietermaritzburg, 1958 ) it will give you an interesting insight into this controversial family

Regards,
Barry.
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Fri Nov 04, 2011 8:24 pm

Barry, many thanks for your detailed answer and book suggestion.
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Tue Dec 13, 2011 5:28 pm

Found this Idea

They where discussing men removed for burial, Scott it seems was left Buried on the field of battle.


I'm going to beg to differ with you, I know of a third. Trooper George Thompson MacLeroy, Natal Carbineers, was initially buried where he fell. Hence the marker inscribed 'G.M.' on the Fugitives' Trail, however his body was exhumed and he was buried in the Commercial Road Cemetery, Pietermaritzburg.


Cheers
DB14
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Wed Dec 14, 2011 2:10 pm

Small issue Barry.

The Bishop died still in control of the Cathedral in PMB in June 1883.
When he had published his two books your quite right the settlers perceived him as a threat and Bishop Gray of Caape Town attempted a deposition on him. This was overturned by the Judicial Commitee in London. Gray eventually managed to have him excommunicated and apointed a rival as the Bishop of Natal.
When he died he was still being paid by the theological socsiety in London and was still preaching in PMB. His excommunication was never officially ratified in London.

He wasnt sent back to London and as to wether he was defrocked, its a mute point.

In later years the perception of the Bishop alterered and a considered reading of his books actually puts him alongside the Archbishop Tutu in his leanings. At the time hated by the population because of his exposing the racial hated and bias in Natal.

Its been said that Durnford was a kindred spirit. And considering his success in dealing with his Native forces and his handling of the Border issue its probably right. Taking that thought slightly further surely Durnfords thoughts and leanings couldnt really have been developed in Victorian England? Is it not therefore possible that the Bishop had more than a profound effect on him?

If there again that extrapolation is accurate, would it not be an extention to say that with the depth of religion surrounding him, and its effect, would his relationship with Miss Colenso have gone beyond the bounds of Victorian ethics? Perhaps therefore the much critisised relationship was therefor merely platonic. Theres no real evidence to suggest otherwise.

Regards
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PostSubject: Where Lt Scott is buried   Wed Dec 14, 2011 6:24 pm

Hi Springbok.
I have always thought Fanny & Anthony's relationship was strictly plutonic and have posted so previously on the Forum , although I have no evidence in which to support this claim . Idea
cheers 90th. 😕
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Feb 02, 2012 4:10 pm

From the inquiry against Captain Shepstone

The brothers Scott went to the battlefield in October 1879 to remove the remians of their brother who fell beside Colonel Dunnford. At the same time a party was sent at the request of the late Bishop of Natal to remove the late Colonel's body.


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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Feb 02, 2012 7:35 pm

Quote :
At the same time a party was sent at the request of the late Bishop of Natal to remove the late Colonel's body

Didn't know he was involved in the removal of his body.......
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Feb 02, 2012 8:12 pm

Who ? scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Feb 02, 2012 8:41 pm

I take it we are talking about Bishop Colenso. scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Feb 02, 2012 8:42 pm

Didn't know he was involved in the removal of his body.

Did you mean Bishop Colonso ?


Cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Feb 02, 2012 8:45 pm

Confusing this. scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Feb 02, 2012 8:46 pm

When you wrote Didn't know he was involved in the removal of his body.

Who didn't you know was involved ?


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PostSubject: Re: Where Is Lt. Scott N.C. Buried ?   Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:02 pm

DB. Look at 24ths posts. He asking are you talking about the Bishop Colenso.
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PostSubject: Where is Lt.Scott NC Buried    Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:03 am

Hi 24th .
DB posted that Colenso ' Requested ' they look for Durnford's remains , not that Colenso was actually there himself .
Is that what you mean ? . Salute Salute .
cheers 90th. Very Happy
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