Was Charlie Harford a liar?

Subject: Re: Was Charlie Harford a liar? Tue Sep 30, 2014 4:43 pm

Hi 6pd
Yep Newmans account is definitely second hand, and very inaccurate, and do the other accounts efface Harford, or merely reflect the times in that junior officers are there to do guard duties and menial tasks. I would think that's really the scenario in that the senior officers claimed as their right all the glory.
Typically Victorian military attitude?
I stick up for Harford because of his record, its pretty damned good and he doesn't make a lot of it himself, in fact a lot of his exploits would be unheard of if it wasn't for his contemporaries.
Right now the ghost of David Rattray is preparing to haunt an expat pom in Aussie. Very Happy

So be careful Im pretty sure he knows how to get to the older colonies Very Happy

Posts : 588 Join date : 2013-05-07 Location : Brecon

Next time I am able I will post the account in Records of 1/24th written by Black as he uses the word 'glen' - being a Glaswegian - when referring to the river and fugitives' drift - which Keith Smith consulted for his book. Black mentions all the names involved, nevertheless according to Black Harford does seemed to have played a minor role in this episode.

As Harford was a particular favourite of DR - around which he based his stories - like the characters in movie 'Zulu' we remember with affection these stories when perhaps they were an embellishment of the true facts.

Posts : 1086 Join date : 2012-05-12 Location : NYC

springbok9 wrote:: Right now the ghost of David Rattray is preparing to haunt an expat pom in Aussie. So be careful Im pretty sure he knows how to get to the older colonies

Duly noted! Then I will pull my socks up and endeavor to a more respectful comportment. Salute

Posts : 1261 Join date : 2010-04-12

Most soldiers bend the truth somewhat. Why should this man be any different? Perhaps that why it was never meant for publication. .

Posts : 1603 Join date : 2009-09-21

24th wrote:: [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Source:THE ZULU WAR. Bay of Plenty Times, Volume VIII, Issue 720, 24 April 1879, Page 3

I notice in this article, Harford is mentioned, albeit the name being wrongly spelled. But the credit is given to Harbour, based on the date of the article possibly more the truth.

Posts : 1086 Join date : 2012-05-12 Location : NYC

Dave wrote:: I notice in this article, Harford is mentioned, albeit the name being wrongly spelled. But the credit is given to Harbour, based on the date of the article possibly more the truth.

Just confirming Harber/Harbour and Harford are different officers. The 1/24th journal lists both among the participants of the second day search party. It occurred to me that Harbour/Harber might be a misspelling of Harford when I first saw it, but no.

(And I suppose I should also add that in Harford's own account (posted on the first page of this thread by Xhosa) he says he pointed Captain Harber to the pole that Captain Harber pulled from the river. So Harbour is not a mispelling of Harford it is a mispelling of Harber.)

Posts : 2308 Join date : 2010-07-02 Age : 44

Here's the same story with the correct spellings.

Scroll to recovering the colours.

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Posts : 588 Join date : 2013-05-07 Location : Brecon

As promised the Records of the 1/2th Regiment state:

On 4th February Lieut Colonel Black who in a previous reconnaissance had discovered the bodies of Lieuts Melvill & Coghill set out with the following officers of the NNC – Captains Harber, Gubbins, Greaves, Underhill, MacIntosh, Lieuts Trow, Hillier, Harford, Murray, Sheppard, Barry, Higginson, Godfrey, Goldsburg, Pohl, Sutherland, Long, Ryder and Raw, to try and find the lost Queens Colour of the 1/24th Regiment. The party raised a cairn over the bodies of Mevill & Coghill, and descended into the glen through which the Buffalo runs in deep curves about 400 yards lower downstream than where Melvill crossed first, Hillier found the Cover, Trow the Crest, and finally about 50 yards above Harber raised the Colour from the water, it having jammed between the stones. The party returned to Rorke’s Drift and gave over the Colour to Colonel Glyn which was next day escorted by the above party to the two Companies now representing the 1/24th Regiment.

On 14th April, the bodies of Lieutenants Coghill & Melvill which were covered by a cairn by the party under Colonel Black on the 4th February, were buried close to the spot where they fell, & on the rock above a Marble Cross, the gift of Sir Bartle Frere was set up.

Posts : 1086 Join date : 2012-05-12 Location : NYC

Kenny wrote:: As promised the Records of the 1/2th Regiment state:

Thanks for closing the loop. Salute

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