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Film Zulu: (Michael Caine) Sixty. We dropped at least 60, wouldn't you say? (Gert van den Bergh) That leaves only 3,940.
 
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impi

impi

Posts : 2308
Join date : 2010-07-02
Age : 40

Zulu Weapons. Empty
PostSubject: Zulu Weapons.   Zulu Weapons. EmptyThu Jul 15, 2010 9:34 am

Photo's taken by some chap on his tour of SA.

The first photo a broad ended spear. What would that have been used for? Because I was thinking it would need a lot of force to push that through a uniform of a British Soldier.

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90th

90th

Posts : 10107
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

Zulu Weapons. Empty
PostSubject: zulu weapons   Zulu Weapons. EmptyFri Jul 16, 2010 3:13 am

Hi Impi.
You will find that the first picture is of a throwing spear , the blades were much smaller than the large bladed
stabbing spears .
cheers 90th.
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Dave

Dave

Posts : 1605
Join date : 2009-09-21

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Weapons.   Zulu Weapons. EmptyFri Jul 16, 2010 3:49 pm

But would the Broard bladed spear have been used as a stabbing spear or throwing. But can see Impi's point with regards to the force need to push home.
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90th

90th

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PostSubject: zulu weapons   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 2:10 am

hi dave .
Not sure exactly what you mean :) . The throwing spear is a simliar width to the stabbing spear but the blade is much
shorter in the throwing spear about 5 inches or thereabouts , you dont need to be up close with the throwing spear as it gathers speed once thrown
and would enter a body especially a human one quite easily , They are intented for what the name implies to be thrown
from a distance . Now , the stabbing spear has a blade about 14 - 16 inch in length and wouldnt take much effort to plunge
it into an unlucky enemy . It is more than likely that the throwing spear was the weapon which was used at the end when the troops
were out of ammo and standing back to back with fixed bayonets as the zulu couldnt get close enough to use their stabbing spears.
The british soldier with a fixed bayonet had a 6 ft range or thereabouts , Neil will be able to confirm the exact differance . Hope this
helps clear up your question.
cheers 90th.
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Chard1879

Chard1879

Posts : 1261
Join date : 2010-04-12

Zulu Weapons. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Zulu Weapons.   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 10:16 am

Dave- Impi. I can see what you are relating to with refrence to the first photo. It looks like the tip as worn away or has broken off.

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Hope you can see what i'm getting at.
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90th

90th

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PostSubject: zulu weapons   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 11:17 am

hi all.
Hi Chard1879.
The picture you show is of a throwing spear it seems the tip is missing , but only the tip .
Your red corrections arent viable to that spear in my opinion. The throwing spears may be
a little broader at the back end of the blade most likely for stabilization purposes as it travels
through the air . It is quite easy to spot the differance when you have throwing and stabbing
spears alongside one another . Hope this helps you undrestand the differance Idea .
cheers 90th.
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Umbiki

Umbiki

Posts : 131
Join date : 2010-07-04
Location : Gloucester, UK

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Weapons.   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 1:36 pm

Hi Everyone

Just to illustrate further 90th's points above, you might like to take a look at

http://gallery.me.com/umbiki#100180&bgcolor=black&view=grid

where I've added some photographs (hope the link works because I'm only just getting into setting up a gallery to share my photos!).

Assuming the link does work, you can see the difference in blade types between the throwing and stabbing spear. I believe this example of throwing spear to be of the isiphapha type - traditionally used for hunting bigger game. The blade is 11 inches long, heavy and clearly designed to thump home with some velocity. Indeed, I have witnessed a similar but lighter type stick into a tree like a dart in a dartboard over a distance of about 30 metres. Notice too, how the shaft is that much longer than that of the stabbing spear to assist the overall balance and aerodynamics of the weapon. I can only conclude that stopping one of these things in flight is not to be recommended!

The stabbing spear - assegai or iklwa - whichever you prefer, has a shorter haft - much easier to handle at close quarters where you don't want unnecessary lengths of wood waving about behind you and getting in the way! The blade on this example is 16" long and quite thin - just under two inches at it's widest point - but still best to avoid if you can possibly help it!

Interestingly, there is a story that in 1879, Evelyn Wood organised a spear throwing contest for his troops but was disappointed that the winner was a Hottentot, about 5' in height, who threw an "assegai" some 70 yards, second was a colonial englishman but no Zulu threw an "assegai" further than 50 yards.

Hope this is of help and interest.

U
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90th

90th

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PostSubject: zulu weapons   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 1:41 pm

hi umbiki.
Thanks for the help , and yes the link worked . :) .
cheers 90th.
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Umbiki

Umbiki

Posts : 131
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Location : Gloucester, UK

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Weapons.   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 1:55 pm

Thanks 90th - glad it worked - I must be good for something - which is contrary to what the woman in my life would tell you! :lol:

U
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90th

90th

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PostSubject: zulu weapons   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 1:58 pm

umbiki.
You and me both :lol!: .
cheers 90th.
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24th

24th

Posts : 1851
Join date : 2009-03-25

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Weapons.   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 2:10 pm

Quote :
"....the Zulu army arose, listen to me!, and moved forward with great speed." (Magema M Fuze)

Where is this from. Was it said in one of the Battles.
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Umbiki

Umbiki

Posts : 131
Join date : 2010-07-04
Location : Gloucester, UK

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Weapons.   Zulu Weapons. EmptySat Jul 17, 2010 5:50 pm

Hi 24th,

I digress from the thread but only to quickly explain the quote is from a book called, "The Black People and Whence They came" (in isiZulu, "Abantu Abamnyama (Lapa Bavela Ngakona"). It was written by a Zulu - Magema M Fuze - in Zulu in 1902 but not published until 1922. In essence it is a Zulu view of Zulu history.

Fuze was born in Zululand in 1840 but moved to Natal at an early age and converted to christianity under a lifelong association with Bishop Colenso. He visited Kings Mpande (in 1859 with Colenso) and Cetshwayo (shortly before the AZW) and was Dinizulu's tutor during the latter's exile in St Helena in the 1890s.

I liked this quote the first time I ever read it because it seemed to me that despite being effectively a longstanding Natal, christian Zulu - and though writing some 20 years after the event - you can (in my view) still sense the pride as he emphatically tells us, "listen to me!" when describing the speed of the Zulu advance after being discovered at iSandlwana. That's my interpretation anyway! But back to the spears ..... otherwise I'll be having them chucked at me for hi-jacking this thread! Wink

U
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ADMIN

ADMIN

Posts : 3927
Join date : 2008-11-01
Age : 61
Location : KENT

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Weapons.   Zulu Weapons. EmptySun Jul 18, 2010 9:49 pm

Quote :
otherwise I'll be having them chucked at me for hi-jacking this thread!
:lol!:
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