Private James Chick

Does anyone have more information on Private James Chick or know where I might find more information? I think he may be related to me but I need more information such as place of birth or date of birth to be able to confirm this.

James Chick 25B/1335
Attested 8/3/1877 Posted to 2nd Battalion at Brecon 11/5/1877. Acted as assistant schoolmaster. Served in the Kaffir War 1978. Served in the Zulu War 1879, a Private in D Company and a patient in the hospital at RD KIA. No trace of a claim for his effects. Buried at RD and has his name on the monument.
Courtesy of The Noble 24th.

Sorry Blackdog67
I can't find any information on Chick's birthplace or date .
90th

looking forward to Thursday Gary?

Hi,

I have found about 53 suspects on Ancestry.com.

If you think you are related to JC have you any idea where your family lived at the time to give me a clue?

Ta

Simon

My family were originally from Somerset (West Chinnock/Crewkerne) but in the mid to late 19th Century several members moved to the valleys (near Pontypridd) to work in the mines.

Is there any way of finding our how old James Chick was when he died? I have done a free search of the 1871 Census and have found 1 James of approximately the right age in Glamorgan and 3 in Somerset.

Glamorgan

Name: James Chick
Age: 23
Born In: 1848
Profession: Candle Maker

Somerset

Name: James Chick
Age: 14
Born In: 1857
Profession: Labourer

Name: James Chick
Age: 12
Born In: 1859
Profession: Labourer

Name: James Chick
Age: 11
Born In: 1860
Profession: Agricultural Labourer

Hi

Glamorgan Chick was still alive in 1881, still making candles.....

Will try finding others...

ta

Simon

Hi

Had a quick glance at the later census's and it would seem (and I must stress I am only an amateur at this stuff):-

1857 Chick died in 1935
1859 Chick moved to Yorkshire was still alive in 1911
1860 chick was still alive in 1881

Incidentally a (or more than one) James Chick was imprisoned twice or three times in Somerset around the 1870s (larceny x2 and Grievous wounding)

Given the fact that he acted as schoolmaster - he must have had some education......this does not mean (of course) that all 'labourers' were illiterate

Unless some one can find out his age when he attested, it will be hard to get his age - I would assume that being in the 2nd/24th - he would have been a younger soldier - so I would look for someone around the early to mid twenties (but this is only my gut feeling and not gospel)

You need a chick in the 1871 census around the right age (14-16) - who is not in the 1881 census (Check the LDS genealogy webpages - they have the 81 census on line for free - or used to have) - its a pain but you just have to cross reference them.


Ta

Simon

Thanks so much for the above info guys. I'll keep looking!

Hi

You have to register but it appears to be 'free' (it used to be years ago)

https://www.familysearch.org/en/

Just out of interest, in Britain, you had to register births, marriages & deaths (after 1837) - what if the death was a soldier on active service?

Were these individuals not registered or would they have been registered, (for example) as if at their depot base?

In my own family tree I have two distant relations who died in WW1 - and apart from the military records, they do not seem to be 'registered' in the normal way

Thanks

Simon

Just a thought, is there any entry for Pte. Chick in the Date became ineffective section of the Pay & Muster Roll of the 2nd/24th?  Sometimes that reveals further information.

JY

Hi,

Assuming that:-

A) Chick was his real name
B) James was his real name or his first name and not the name he preferred
C) He knew how to spell his own surname - he was a assistant schoolteacher.

James Chicks born 1857 - 1861

1861, 1871 and finally 1881 (obviously not him)

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This info is taken from Ancestry.com and census's were not 100% accurate due to being transcribed at various stages (sometimes apparently by prisoners?), accents, illiteracy of people filling them in and them not being so obsessed by 'age' as we are now (my Great Grandfather altered his age depending on the age of his wives - shaving a bit off each time he married a younger woman!)

Ta

Simon

John

It is a good lead - this would be in WO16-1579 in the National Archives. I wonder why neither Norman Holme nor Alan Baynham-Jones spotted this entry on the ineffective section of the pay & muster roll. It would have given his place of birth as you point out. I do not have a copy of this roll. Perhaps Bill Sherriff who has done considerable work in recent months on these rolls could help.

Chick was at the 25th Bde Depot (Brecon) from 3.3.1877 to 1.5.1877 when he was posted to 2/24th. I have found nothing relating to him in the local Welsh newspapers at the time - yes, he is listed a casualty at RD - but there is no family entry for him. Perhaps he was a Somerset lad - but J C Kenworthy who wrote about Somersets' role in AZW did not list him. It is possible that he enlisted under an alias - some 5-10% of recruits did in those days.

Interesting enough - the James Cheek (servant in the 1871 census) joined the army in 1877 - into the 36th regiment.

Kenny,

Any idea how long Chick’s effects would have been advertised for in The London Gazette?

JY

Hi,

Sorry only just saw this early today. The information contained in the Effects & Credits section of the 2/24th pay-lists for their time in Africa is, unfortunately, somewhat sparse.

They rarely contain the Place of Birth, Trade or Enlistment date which you would normally expect. The casualties for the 22nd January have only Number, Rank, Name with initial rather than full name, with Killed In Action and the date. The majority have Isandlwana as a place, even some of those killed at Rorke's Drift. (including Pte Chick).

He appears directly as a Private in the pay-list from the 8th March 1877, he is not shown in any recruits section or listings as you would expect if he was recruited in the 25th Bde area. The service number sequence for the pay period October 76 to March 77 runs from the mid 800's to about 1400 indicating some increase in recruiting.

There are quite a few soldiers appearing directly in the pay-list and not in the recruits section, with similar service numbers to Pte Chick. This could POSSIBLY mean they were recruited in another district and transferred over, thus they were not native to South Wales (or at least the Brecon district). I believe recruits were still subject to General Service, although they could indicate a preference for a particular Regiment, the needs of the Army dictated where they were posted. I have seen other Brigade District pay-lists for a particular Regiment which listed other recruits for different Bde areas, including a number for the 25th Bde, so it is a possibility he lived elsewhere.

There is nothing in the remarks column against his name, until the April to June 1877 quarter list where he is posted to the 2nd Battalion.

Sorry, unless someone chances across another Brigade Depot list with his name, there is not a great deal more the Regimental records can say, it was just not fully recorded.

Bill

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A possible, from WO 12/10264 37th Bde Depot (includes 36th Bde 13th Regt at Taunton)not sure if it's Chick or Cheek. Not in the next depot list but will have to check 13th's paylist to see if he was there. Bit annoying as I had the 13th Regt ledger out from that period today to check Mounted Infantry entries , just didn't join the dots.

Third from bottom on Depot strength from 19th to 29th January 1877 enlisted King's Brompton near Dulverton Somerset

Finally! Although no age given, maybe worth a shot to see if he was local.

James Chick enlisted 03/03/1877 29th Brigade Depot Northampton[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Well done Bill.
This from the Billing Road Cemetery, Northampton (8924 and 8925) The National Archives RG 37/113/6:-


Albert Edward (above) lived at 13 Halzelwood Road, Northampton in 1912 and was baptised 22nd February 1863.
In 1901 he resided at 55 Holly Road Northampton St Giles Northampton. He was a collector of income tax and solicitors clerk and had two step daughters Florence M. (25. Part proprietor of a cafe) and Alice E. (24) and a son Albert Edward Chick (4). Source 1901 census
With the practise of naming the first born boy after their father could the Kinsale Chick be our James Chick's his father? Though living in Ireland there is obviously a Northampton connection.


There also appears to be a James Chick living at 8 Foundry Street, Court2, All Saints, Northampton in 1886. (Electoral registers South Ward District No10)
And on January 7th at Court 2 Foundry-Street. James Chick aged 61/4? died (The Northampton Mercury Saturday January 10th 1874)
May be some other leads in the above.
Kate

Further to the above it seems the Northampton Chick's were pipe makers by trade
Northampton Mercury 10th January 1874:-

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Interestingly there was a Private Chick in the Royal Bucks. Yeomanry (E Troop Newport Pagnell) Northampton Chronicle and Echo 24th July 1889.

Hope you can read this but there is a Private Chick near the bottom of the first article Northampton Mercury 3rd March 1877

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He still seems to be with the N.R.V. on 22nd September 1877 as he won a prize in a shooting contest and is still with them in November 1879. So not him then.

There was a James Chick living at Foundry Street in February 1879 as someone tried to steal his chickens (a fowl crime). He was assisted by his brother to detain the suspect. Northampton Mercury 15th February 1879

1861 census Pipe Makers Yard 3 Foundry Street, All Saints Northampton
James Chick Pipe Maker age 51 born 1810 in Hampshire
Elizabeth Chick born 1811 Northampton
James Chick unmarried age 17 born 1844 pipe maker
William Chick unmarried age 15 born 1846 pipe maker
Charles Chick age 12 scholar

1871 Census
No2 Court Foundry Street
William Chick age 25 Pipe maker
Hannah Chick wife age 24
No3 Court
James Chick age 62 pipe maker
Elizabeth Chick age 61
Charles Chick age 22 printer?
Ellen Chick (wife) age 24

9 Foundry Street All Saints Northampton
James Chick age 27
Sarah Chick (wife) age 31
Spencer J.  son age 5
Mary A. daughter age 1

The James Chick married to Sarah was still around in 1891 and had 7 children.
Of course it might just be a pipe dream thinking the RD Chick is linked to this family. All of the above might be a blind alley but it may be useful to someone in the future.
Kate

Further to my ramblings above there is another family in the 1851 census residing at Upper Harding Street, Extra Parochial, Northampton.
Jacob Watts (aged 64) and Elizabeth Watts age 57(Hawkers by trade) who had three children
Mary Chick aged 22 dressmaker
John Chick aged 25 pipe maker born London
James Chick age 3 born Northampton.

Interestingly in 1841 census for Upper Harding Street, Jacob and Elizabeths children Elizabeth (14) Scolna (13) Mary (10) and William (8) all have the surname of Watts

In 1861 they were all at 37 Upper Harding Street  with two additional children Louise Chick aged 7 and John Chick age 4

In 1871 it appears Jacobs and Elizabeth have died leaving 7 children all with the surname of Chick John (a45), Mary (a42), Louisa (a19),John (15) and Mary (a9), William (a5) and Henry (a2) Intriguingly James has disappeared?
More digging needed.
And its not him. A James Chick died in 1868 in Northampton at the age of 21. The dates sort of tally with Jacob's son James. Rats.

However this looks promising from the Northampton Mercury 1st February 1863:-
"February 9th at Northampton, the wife of Sergeant Major Chick, Royal Artillery of a son."

Thanks for the above, my genealogy research is a bit rusty as the last 4 years I have been concentrating on the AZW.

Obviously it may not be strictly accurate in this case but the vast majority of recruits whose age is given fall between the ages of 18-22 years. Therefore he would be born around 1854/55 to 1858 early 1859. He was not in the boys section of district recruits in the 25th Bde Brecon pay-list (there was one) but amongst 269 men from outside the region who were recruited in the January to March quarter of 1877.

He may be local to Northampton, he may not, but we have no other info so far on him (D.O.B. place of birth etc) in the Regimental records. He was at Brecon from 7th March to 10th May 1877 which MAY indicate he needed full training and thus had never served in the Militia etc.

Hopefully you may stumble upon something definitive.

Bill

This may be the Glamorgan link mentioned by Blackdog67 above.

Found this at Trealaw cemetery in the Rhondda.
Names:
William Chick - died 1897 (51?)
Rose Jane Chick-died 1923 (78)
Mary Jane Appleby, could be Nee Chick? -died (?)
And the ashes of Chester M Appleby" Foley"(?)

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Will have a closer look at the stone next time I'm in the area.
Eddie

Hi
In relation to the Headstone above and probably just a coincidence, but there was a Conductor Martin Foley, escapee from Isandlwana. Just thought there may some day be link between Chick and Foley families.