Latest topics | » The Pictorial World - March 15th 1879![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Yesterday at 1:13 pm by ben2000 » The lost diary of Pvt James Owen![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 25, 2024 12:03 pm by miklew » Last of the 24th at Isandhlwana![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 24, 2024 6:16 pm by John Young » What was the uniform of field marshals/generals in the zulu war?![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Jul 22, 2024 6:53 am by John Young » Henderson and the NNH at Rorke's Drift ![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Jul 20, 2024 12:17 pm by SRB1965 » Capt. D. Hayes 1/3rd Regt., NNC![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 18, 2024 11:11 am by Julian Whybra » The Wrecked Camp![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 17, 2024 4:33 pm by Julian Whybra » Private N/N John Robert Branch 90th Regiment and his discovered diary![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Jul 15, 2024 8:53 pm by 1879graves » Private John Scott 24th Regiment a fugitive at large![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 12:06 pm by 1879graves » 90th foot sgt T. Collins 214![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 10:57 am by johnman » Baron Von Steitencron![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 10, 2024 3:10 pm by Julian Whybra » Sgt Joseph Windridge, Defender of Rorke's Drift - Memorial![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Jul 09, 2024 3:15 am by 90th » Writing advice![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 07, 2024 4:04 pm by Julian Whybra » South Africa 1877-79, 1 clasp, 1877-8-9 (4389 Fr. Sergt. S. Smith. O/2. Bde. R.A.)![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 07, 2024 9:30 am by rai » The trashing of the Zulu monument to the brave warriors at Isandlawana March 12, 2024 has been blamed on scrap metal scavengers.![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:41 pm by ADMIN» The Goodwill Zulu Festival: Celebrating the Welsh and KwaZulu Natal Shared Heritage.![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:27 pm by ADMIN» Any nominal role of G Coy 2/24th regiment ![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 11:18 am by Wayne » Bassage Diary![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 9:31 am by Julian Whybra » Prior to Sihayo's Kraal ![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 9:19 am by 90th » British Fort Locations![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 3:40 am by 90th » Sergeant 1064 Tom Hick / Hicks G Company 2/24th Regiment![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 03, 2024 11:05 am by Julian Whybra » A Hungarian soldier in the Zulu War (?)![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jun 28, 2024 2:31 pm by Mr M. Cooper » Private 25B/279 Henry Sears Bugler E Company 24th Reg. KIA Isandlwana![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 27, 2024 1:07 pm by gardner1879 » Hamilton Browne's birthday![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jun 21, 2024 9:22 am by Julian Whybra » Zulu "Corps"![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 20, 2024 6:01 pm by Hobbes » Army Pay Department Personnel![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 20, 2024 11:49 am by Julian Whybra » Ntshingwayo birth date![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jun 16, 2024 11:37 am by Hobbes » Zibhebhu and Cetshwayo's family![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:11 pm by Julian Whybra » Smith's Store/Hotel![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jun 05, 2024 6:06 pm by Julian Whybra » Corporal James Frowen Williams F Company. ![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Jun 04, 2024 5:20 pm by Julian Whybra » Shaka iLembe![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Jun 01, 2024 1:27 pm by Jon84 » Bugler 1415 Thomas Finn / Flin 90th Regiment ![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat May 25, 2024 11:28 am by johnman » Inspector-General Evelyn Richard Hugh Pollard![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue May 14, 2024 10:13 am by ADMIN» Alfred Fairlie Henderson photographs.![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat May 11, 2024 8:01 am by Julian Whybra » Fairlie's Native Police![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu May 02, 2024 9:12 pm by Hobbes |
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New topics | » The Pictorial World - March 15th 1879![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Yesterday at 1:13 pm by ben2000 » The lost diary of Pvt James Owen![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 25, 2024 12:03 pm by miklew » Last of the 24th at Isandhlwana![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 24, 2024 5:53 pm by miklew » What was the uniform of field marshals/generals in the zulu war?![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 21, 2024 12:30 pm by darthvaix » Henderson and the NNH at Rorke's Drift ![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jul 19, 2024 1:29 pm by SRB1965 » Capt. D. Hayes 1/3rd Regt., NNC![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 17, 2024 10:52 pm by Julian Whybra » The Wrecked Camp![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 8:51 am by 61MECH » The trashing of the Zulu monument to the brave warriors at Isandlawana March 12, 2024 has been blamed on scrap metal scavengers.![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:41 pm by ADMIN» The Goodwill Zulu Festival: Celebrating the Welsh and KwaZulu Natal Shared Heritage.![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:27 pm by ADMIN |
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| | Officers at Ulundi | |
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gardner1879
![gardner1879](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/3201-48.jpg)
Posts : 3460 Join date : 2021-01-04
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Officers at Ulundi Wed May 05, 2021 4:02 pm | |
| Does anyone on here have access to or know if there is a list of all the British Officers present IN THE SQUARE at Ulundi? Many officers claim to have been in at the kill but when you scratch the surface they were on the other side of the river at Fort Nolele and most were probably sitting twiddling their thumbs thinking " does the General want me to fight the Zulu or just observe their natural habitat" Kate ![Very Happy](https://2img.net/i/fa/i/smiles/icon_biggrin.png) |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 90th
![90th](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/22-38.jpg)
Posts : 10890 Join date : 2009-04-07 Age : 68 Location : Melbourne, Australia
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Officers at Ulundi Thu May 06, 2021 5:06 am | |
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| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Thu May 06, 2021 12:28 pm | |
| Kate probably not a lot of help but I have seen a reference to 122 officers at Ulundi with 3 KIA. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | John Young
![John Young](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/1461-56.jpg)
Posts : 3256 Join date : 2013-09-08 Age : 68 Location : Слава Україні! Героям слава!
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Thu May 06, 2021 1:45 pm | |
| Kate,
Try They Fell Like Stones pages 185 - 196.
JY |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 90th
![90th](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/22-38.jpg)
Posts : 10890 Join date : 2009-04-07 Age : 68 Location : Melbourne, Australia
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Officers at Ulundi Thu May 06, 2021 1:47 pm | |
| Kate John Young lists Officers in his book but not sure if those that stayed at Ft Nolela may also be listed ? , John will hopefully see this . 90th |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | gardner1879
![gardner1879](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/3201-48.jpg)
Posts : 3460 Join date : 2021-01-04
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Thu May 06, 2021 4:43 pm | |
| Thanks chaps for all your help. John I had looked at 'They Fell Like Stones' but as your very comprehensive list contained Major F.S. Russell, 14th Hussars, assumed that the officers listed were all those with Chelmsford's force rather than just those in the square. I appreciate it is a while ago but when you were carrying out your research did you come across a list of officers who were actually in the square? Kate |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | John Young
![John Young](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/1461-56.jpg)
Posts : 3256 Join date : 2013-09-08 Age : 68 Location : Слава Україні! Героям слава!
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Thu May 06, 2021 6:44 pm | |
| Kate,
No I only included those evidenced by at least two contemporary sources, together with Hart’s and subsequently published regimental and corps histories. Hence the absence of those who remained in the laager under William Bellairs’ command.
I notice the “but” regarding Russell, do you contend that he remained in Fort Nolela? Doesn’t Chelmsford mention him in his Ulundi despatch? According to Bellairs’ despatch there were a total of forty-nine officers - although that number includes both regular army and colonial forces - who remained in the laager.
The better start might be those forty-nine officers, here’s a start I have deducted the nine officers of the colonial forces, leaving us with the following:
2nd Division. 23 officers of 1st/24th. 2 officers of A.M.D. 9 officers of C. & T. Dept.
Flying Column. 3 officers of the R.E. 2 officers of the A.H.C. 1 officer of the A.S.C. (?)
I have added the query above as the Army Service Corps were officered by either the C. & T. Department or the Ordnance Store Department, so the A.S.C. ‘officer’ might well be a Conductor of Supply.
What is interesting is has Bellairs included himself in the forty regular officers, and where does Smith-Dorrien appear in those figures? Another thing Bellairs does not list any officer from the Frontier Light Horse as remaining in the laager, yet we know that the injured H.C.D. D’Arcy was there.
Open another can of worms please!
JY
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| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | gardner1879
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Posts : 3460 Join date : 2021-01-04
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Thu May 06, 2021 7:32 pm | |
| Thanks for the reply John. I only mentioned Russell because he himself said he was in the fort and not in the square, "I took up my post on the fort with a number of men with telescopes....." see page 233 of Sonia Clarke's "Zululand at War" for his full account. Chelmsford obviously got it wrong. Hand me the tin opener... Kate ![Very Happy](https://2img.net/i/fa/i/smiles/icon_biggrin.png) |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | John Young
![John Young](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/1461-56.jpg)
Posts : 3256 Join date : 2013-09-08 Age : 68 Location : Слава Україні! Героям слава!
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Thu May 06, 2021 8:21 pm | |
| Kate, Interesting that Russell does not elaborate on his role on 4th July 1879, here’s his Hart’s entry from 1883: [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]MacKinnon & Shadbolt 1880 the impression his role is given as follows: [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Yet as you say in Zululand at War he rather contradicts both of the above in his letter to Alison. JY |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 90th
![90th](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/22-38.jpg)
Posts : 10890 Join date : 2009-04-07 Age : 68 Location : Melbourne, Australia
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Officers at Ulundi Fri May 07, 2021 2:14 am | |
| Hi John & Kate So the Officers listed in ' They Fell Like Stones ' were indeed in the Square at Ulundi ? , outstanding ! . As for Russell..... ARGGHHHHH , BLOODY AZW , nothing is ever cut and dried with it ! , I'll have mine on toast with salt and pepper ! . 90th |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | gardner1879
![gardner1879](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/3201-48.jpg)
Posts : 3460 Join date : 2021-01-04
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Sat May 08, 2021 11:13 am | |
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| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Sat May 08, 2021 8:42 pm | |
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| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | gardner1879
![gardner1879](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/3201-48.jpg)
Posts : 3460 Join date : 2021-01-04
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Sat May 08, 2021 9:58 pm | |
| Sorry Frank I forgot to type '14th' in there, though I bet there are some Russian gunners who will agree with my original post. Kate |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Officers at Ulundi Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Officers at Ulundi Sun May 09, 2021 6:54 am | |
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