WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM

Film Zulu quote: Reverend Otto Witt: One thousand British soldiers have been massacred. While I stood here talking peace, a war has started.
 
HomeHome  GalleryGallery  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  
Latest topics
» KEYNSHAMLIGHTHORSE GRAVES WEBSITE
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyYesterday at 1:54 pm by rai

» William De Passey, 17th Lancers.1879.
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Sep 26, 2020 7:38 pm by 1879graves

» Regimental numbers
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyFri Sep 25, 2020 12:55 pm by Frank Allewell

» Lance Corporal Robert Eaton NMP
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyFri Sep 25, 2020 11:25 am by Frank Allewell

» Isandlwana, Last Stands
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyFri Sep 25, 2020 9:13 am by Julian Whybra

» Colour of Lord Chelsmford eyes
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyFri Sep 25, 2020 8:05 am by Simonsole

» List of identified bodies at Isandlwana
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyThu Sep 17, 2020 5:30 am by John Young

» Defenders of Rorkes Drift
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyWed Sep 16, 2020 6:47 pm by Digger

» Colour Sgt Anthony Clark Booth, VC.
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyTue Sep 15, 2020 6:47 pm by ADMIN

» Cpl John Lyons
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyMon Sep 14, 2020 7:49 pm by Bill8183

» A Case of Mistaken Identity?
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyMon Sep 14, 2020 11:29 am by John Young

» What happened next
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyMon Sep 14, 2020 10:51 am by Springbok

» Surgeon Espine Charles Ward
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyWed Sep 09, 2020 9:38 am by John Young

» 2nd Lieutenant William Lancelot James, 2nd/4th Regiment.
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyMon Sep 07, 2020 2:41 pm by ADMIN

» Explaining Amabutho in one word??
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyMon Sep 07, 2020 11:49 am by SRB1965

» Non-Combat Casualties - Royal Navy and Royal Marines
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyThu Sep 03, 2020 4:05 pm by Frank Allewell

» Non-Combat Casualties - Royal Artillery
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyWed Sep 02, 2020 8:01 pm by Catiline63

» Colonel William,Egerton Saunders, C.B
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 10:46 pm by ADMIN

» Lieutenant-Colonel David Campbell Williamson.
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 10:32 pm by ADMIN

» Brigade Surgeon E. J. Boulton
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 10:02 pm by ADMIN

» Joseph Walter O’Malley Martin. Assistant Surgeon
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 9:52 pm by ADMIN

» Quarter-Master William London
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 9:32 pm by ADMIN

» Surgeon Major Henry Lamb
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 9:19 pm by ADMIN

» Lieutenant Robert Thomas Graves Lowry
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 9:13 pm by ADMIN

» Sgt. John Philip Archbell NNC
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 8:43 pm by ADMIN

» Tpr. John Ross Natal Carbineer
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 8:27 pm by ADMIN

» Non-Combat Casualties in Colonial and Native Units
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 11:52 am by Julian Whybra

» Victorian HMS SHAH South Africa Zulu Wars Medal William Morrison Royal Navy
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyFri Aug 28, 2020 5:50 pm by Petty Officer Tom

» South African 1879 Zulu War medal to Corp R Starkey 57th Regiment of Foot
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyFri Aug 28, 2020 3:50 pm by 1879graves

» 2/4th Foot at Hlobane/Kambula
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyFri Aug 28, 2020 4:12 am by 90th

» England's Sons 9th edition
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyWed Aug 26, 2020 6:20 pm by Herbie

» Strange tales from Isandlwana
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySun Aug 23, 2020 4:25 pm by SRB1965

» Colour - Sergeant George William Mabin
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 5:48 pm by Visitor

» Militaria Sale
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyTue Aug 18, 2020 5:59 pm by Frank Allewell

» Men of the 24th Regiment of Foot - Secunderabad, India 1873
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyTue Aug 18, 2020 12:48 am by 90th

Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
Black as Hell, Thick as Grass
Top posters
90th
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Frank Allewell
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
littlehand
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
ADMIN
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
1879graves
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
rusteze
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Chelmsfordthescapegoat
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
John
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Mr M. Cooper
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Julian Whybra
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Top posting users this month
John Young
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Frank Allewell
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
De Passey
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
90th
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
1879graves
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
ADMIN
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
SRB1965
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Kenny
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Simonsole
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
rai
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_leftHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  BarHALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Bar_right 
Most active topics
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Durnford was he capable.1
Durnford was he capable. 4
Durnford was he capable.5
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The ammunition question
Durnford was he capable. 3
Durnford was he capable.2
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Most Viewed Topics
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Adding to the Library
The ammunition question
Recent Members To The ZULU WAR 1879 Discussion & Reference Forum ( A Small Victorian War in 1879)
ISANDLWANA SURVIVIORS
Durnford was he capable.5
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Lieutenant Adendorff 1-3 N.N.C.
Fair Use Notice
Fair use notice. This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner. We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website. If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution.
Keywords
Mounted spalding 24th Police Franklin william Isandlwana henry martini drift Woolfryes Natal George harford gardner payne john Durnford taylor Russell smith horse zulu james melvill Prince

 

 HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for

Go down 
AuthorMessage
ymob

ymob

Posts : 2265
Join date : 2010-10-22
Location : France

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptyFri Oct 09, 2015 5:07 pm

HALLAM-PARR was with CHELMSFORD's column in the Mangeni the 22 january.
In "Major-General Sir Henry Hallam Parr" (1917) he wrote: "(...) about 1 p.m. [he 22 January] it was decided that the camp at Isandlwana should be struck, and the headquarters advanced to a position selected near the conical hill. The troops at Isandlwana were to march on the morning on the 23rd to the camp near the conical hill, and the troops already in the neighbourhood were to bivouac on the new camping-ground that night". (p.111).

Some interesting points on Chelmsford's mind about the Isandhlwana garrisson for the 23 January?

Cheers.

Frédéric

Back to top Go down
http://frbomy@hotmail.fr
rusteze

rusteze

Posts : 2881
Join date : 2010-06-02

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 1:02 am

An interesting find Frederic. Does that mean that the order to Pulleine was to move camp to the Conical Hill and not Mangeni? What does that mean for Durnfords force? Hallam-Parr is a credible witness but why does no-one else mention this camp at the Conical Hill?

Steve
Back to top Go down
90th

90th

Posts : 10136
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: new camp the 23/ 1 / 79   HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 3:23 am

Hi Frederic / Steve
HHP is certainly not referring to the Conical Hill on the plain as I think you may be referring to ? . HHP states they arrived at the conical hill where the force of the previous night had camped at 8.30am , which was 4 hrs after they left iSandlwana ! . I think he's referring to a similar hill in which they proceeded to , or has possibly been a misprint ? . Conical hill on the plain would only have been a few hundred meters from the firing line . Hope this makes sense ? Joker
90th You need to study mo .
PS . In my copy it's on Pages 190-192 .
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7591
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 73
Location : Cape Town South Africa

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 7:45 am

I would fully agree with 90th.
The 'conical hill in front of iSandlwana is named amaTutshane, the one refered to by HHP is Mdutshane.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
This the Mangeni valley shot from the side of the Gorge. The new camp site is on the right of the photo, straight ahead is Mdutshane, the conical hill refered to. Dartnells night stop is of shot to the left. The ridge that the officers and Chelmsfrod looked back onto the camp runs across the photo from the foot of the hill.
Hope that helps.

Cheers
Back to top Go down
ymob

ymob

Posts : 2265
Join date : 2010-10-22
Location : France

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 9:12 am

Bonjour,

Mdutshane is without doubt the conical hill described by HP.
As Steve said, HP was a credible witness, a member of the staff, the man who received the famous message of Pulleine at 9.30 a.m.

About Chelmsford's mind, the points are :
-the move of the camp for the 23;
-despite clear signs of a strong enemy presence in the area, CHELMSFORD persisted in keeping its forces divided for the next 24 hours.

Cheers

Frédéric
Back to top Go down
http://frbomy@hotmail.fr
ymob

ymob

Posts : 2265
Join date : 2010-10-22
Location : France

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 9:13 am

Frank, thanks for the picture.
Back to top Go down
http://frbomy@hotmail.fr
rusteze

rusteze

Posts : 2881
Join date : 2010-06-02

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 11:25 am

Thanks Gary/Frank

That's a great picture. On the previous page Hallam-Parr says goodbye to his servant who was due to go back to Natal. He replies that he will still be at Isandhlwana when Chelmsford returns as there will now be no wagons going back to Rorke's Drift that day. It sounds chaotic with wagons travelling in both directions. Why would they have been going back given they had only just got there, and with some difficulty.

Steve
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7591
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 73
Location : Cape Town South Africa

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 11:48 am

Hi Steve
Smith Dorrien was busy getting supplies to iSandlwana from RD. Interestingly if the attack was on the 23rd, most of the supplies, biscuit boxes and mealie bags would have been transported to iSandlwana. Wonder how Chard would have made out?

Cheers
PS Ive got a panorama some where of that whole basin, I will dig out and post it.
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7591
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 73
Location : Cape Town South Africa

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 11:59 am

There you go Steve.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
This is taken with my back to the foot of Mdutshane straight ahead is the Gorge, to the left on that large flat plain is the camp site. To the right look at the highest hill, just below down the cliff face is a thin rocky ledge with a tree line on the side, that Dartnells camp. To the extreme right is the beginning of the ridge that Chelmsford looked back to the camp with HHP etc. Carry on round to the left and it leads onto the upper valley where the skirmishing took place late 21st and early 22nd. Travel far enough up the valley and you get to iSiphezi and the site of the Zulu camp of the night of the 20th and also Chelmsfords breakfast spot.
Back to top Go down
rusteze

rusteze

Posts : 2881
Join date : 2010-06-02

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 12:04 pm

Ah, the old biscuit box and mealie bag defence strategy. The beauty of that approach to fortifications is that you can eat them when you've done!

Steve
Back to top Go down
90th

90th

Posts : 10136
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Hallam - Parr ; New Camp 23/1/79   HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  EmptySat Oct 10, 2015 12:12 pm

Hi Frank
Thanks for posting the excellent pics , much appreciated by all .
90th Very Happy Joker
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty
PostSubject: Re: HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for    HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for  Empty

Back to top Go down
 
HALLAM-PARR: new camp the 23/01 for
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM  :: GENERAL DISCUSSION AREA-
Jump to: