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 Medals to the Natal Mounted Police

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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


Posts : 41
Join date : 2015-12-27
Location : Victorian London

Medals to the Natal Mounted Police Empty
PostSubject: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 02, 2017 4:15 am

How common are medals to the Natal Mounted Police?
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90th

90th


Posts : 10483
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PostSubject: Medals to the NMP   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 am

Victorian Dad
They are nearly as rare as Hen's Teeth ! . Shocked Shocked Actually... probably rarer !.
90th
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 02, 2017 8:47 am

90th wrote:
Victorian Dad
They are nearly as rare as Hen's Teeth ! . Shocked Shocked Actually... probably rarer !.
90th


I feared that might be the case!!



Off Topic What about later campaigns, is the same to be said?
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 02, 2017 10:29 am

What is interesting is, that the few I've found that have sold over the last couple of years, haven't been that expensive. The cheapest one (without clasp) was £240, another no clasp went for £400. Right up to £6800 for an Isandhlwana casualty.

F. G. H. Bradbury, who was from Bedford, England, attested for the Natal Mounted Police in August 1877 and was one of around 80 officers and men held in reserve at Pietermaritzburg and Harding at the time of the Zulu War. He was discharged in December 1879. £400

Pavy was a member of the Natal Mounted Police’s H.Q. and reserves who didn’t cross the Zululand border and received 80 South Africa Medals without clasp. £240


Trooper Francis Secretan was killed in action at Isandhlwana on 22 January 1879. He was one of 26 men of the Natal Mounted Police killed in the battle, all of whom are recorded by name on the memorial in Pietermaritzburg. Sold with full confirmation. £6800



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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 02, 2017 10:32 am

£26,500 for "The important Rorke’s Drift group of four awarded to Colonel H. “Harry” Lugg, Natal Militia, who, having departed Devon to seek his fortune in South Africa, enlisted as a Trooper in the Natal Mounted Police and fought with distinction in the defence of that place on 22 January 1879: his account of the action - noted for its inclusion of the quote “As black as hell and as thick as grass” - was subsequently published in the home press, while his heroic deeds were further commemorated by his inclusion in Alphonse de Neuville’s famous oil painting, itself said to have been based upon a sketch provided by Lugg"
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90th

90th


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PostSubject: Medals to the NMP   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 02, 2017 2:02 pm

Yes Medals to members of the NMP unclasped ( who didnt get into zululand ) do come up from time to time , and can be purchased for a reasonable price , but the one's for Casualties , or survivors of actions, are rarely seen with the exception of the couple you mention , and they go for Big Bucks ( GBP's ! ) . I've always wanted to get one , along with one to a Natal Carbineer , as well as a couple of other Colonial Units but it hasnt happened .
90th
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 02, 2017 2:18 pm

90th wrote:
Yes Medals to members of the NMP unclasped ( who didnt get into zululand ) do come up from time to time , and can be purchased for a reasonable price , but the one's for Casualties , or survivors of actions,  are rarely seen with the exception of the couple you mention , and they go for Big Bucks ( GBP's ! ) . I've always wanted to get one , along with one to a Natal Carbineer , as well as a couple of other Colonial Units but it hasnt happened .
90th



On my budget an unclasped example is going to be as good as it gets Very Happy .
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90th

90th


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PostSubject: Medals to the NMP   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 02, 2017 2:21 pm

Fair enough VD , might be my only hope as well . Salute
90th
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Brett Hendey

Brett Hendey


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyTue Oct 03, 2017 9:57 am

Although I live in Natal and have a particular interest in local regiments, I have had little success in finding Zulu War medals. For collectors like me, medals to Isandlwana casualties and escapers are impossibly expensive, so I have focussed on the next best and much cheaper medals to men who were on the Dartnell Patrol. Although they were close to the action, they survived intact. They were the first to encounter the horrors on the battlefield.

The single NMP. NC, and Buffalo Border Guard medals to men on the Dartnell Patrol that are in my collection all came from local sources and were relatively cheap. Another much more fortunate local collector recently purchased from the family a NC KIA at Isandlwana for a bargain price after it had it had received an insultingly low offer from a London auction house.

There are occasionally benefits to living in the Colonies!

Brett
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90th

90th


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PostSubject: Medals to the NMP   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyTue Oct 03, 2017 2:04 pm

Hi Brett .
I dont doubt it Brett ! . Salute
90th
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 01, 2018 9:07 am

Victorian Dad wrote:
90th wrote:
Yes Medals to members of the NMP unclasped ( who didnt get into zululand ) do come up from time to time , and can be purchased for a reasonable price , but the one's for Casualties , or survivors of actions,  are rarely seen with the exception of the couple you mention , and they go for Big Bucks ( GBP's ! ) . I've always wanted to get one , along with one to a Natal Carbineer , as well as a couple of other Colonial Units but it hasnt happened .
90th



On my budget an unclasped example is going to be as good as it gets Very Happy .





My quest to try and obtain a medal (any medal) to the Natal Mounted Police goes on.

But something that has occurred to me is, should I be lucky enough to actually find one, just how much scope is there into researching them?



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Brett Hendey

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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 01, 2018 10:51 am

Most men in the NMP at the time of the Zulu War were British-born, so their early lives may be well documented, but records in South African archives tend to be sparse to non-existent. Terry Sole's account of the NMP in his book on the Colonials in the AZW does at least give a context for the men and their service in that war

Brett
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90th

90th


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PostSubject: Medal to the NMP    Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 01, 2018 12:44 pm

I was lucky enough to get a NMP SAGS from the last Spinx medal Auction , it was to a chap who had the same initials as my father , I couldn't let it slide !
90th Shocked
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Oct 01, 2018 1:59 pm

Brett Hendey wrote:
Most men in the NMP at the time of the Zulu War were British-born, so their early lives may be well documented, but records in South African archives tend to be sparse to non-existent.   Terry Sole's account of the NMP in his book on the Colonials in the AZW does at least give a context for the men and their service in that war

Brett


Thanks Brett. I'll keep searching perhaps one day, I'll find one............................
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90th

90th


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PostSubject: Medals to the NMP   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyTue Oct 02, 2018 3:40 am

Victorian Dad if I see an unclasped NMP medal I'll let you know.
Cheers 90th Salute
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyTue Oct 02, 2018 9:59 am

90th wrote:
Victorian Dad if I see an unclasped NMP medal I'll let you know.
Cheers 90th Salute

Many thanks 90th, I'd appreciate that!!!!!
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Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptySun Aug 04, 2019 3:12 pm

There's a nice no clasp example currently on Ebay if anyone's got £715 spare?

The medal comes with a photograph of the chap.

It's got an unofficial clasp which is loose on the ribbon.

Would very much like to buy if but I fear I'll just have to admire it from afar!!




The write up states....

A Rare South Africa 1877-79 medal Natal Mounted Police. Condition is NEF postage will be Royal Mail special delivery insured UK only

Please note delivery within UK only

SCARCE SOUTH AFRICA 1879 TO THE NATAL MOUNTED POLICE

SOUTH AFRICA 1877-9, NO CLASP ‘TR. W CHARLESWORTH. NATAL MD. POLICE
WITH AN UNOFFICIAL PERIOD 1877-8-9 BAR (NOT ENTITLED)

Condition NEF, nice dark patina. A very desirable unit
89 no clasp medals to the Natal Mounted Police, 7 of which were returned unissued

Walter Charlesworth enlisted (no 128), along with his brother Thomas (no 125) as a
troopers in the Natal Mounted Police on 17th August 1876. Walter served in the Zulu
War of 1879; service in Natal (no clasp).

1899 Walter Charlesworth a Road Overseer at Dundee tried at Ladysmith for
supplying liquor to a native girl. Died 25th of July 1905 aged 50 yrs. See period
picture of Walter in uniform with his horse.

Walter’s brother Thomas also served in the Zulu War (no clasp medal) but died on 6th
February 1884 while serving as a Mounted Constable. He drowned while swimming
with his horse over the flooded Peters Creek, south of Darwin in the Northern
Territory, Australia. He was trying to locate an overdue coach which was carrying a
large consignment of gold. His body was later recovered by a police search party and
buried near where he was found.

The Natal Mounted Police represented the only permanent force in Natal. Initially this
force had very little support from the Colonial authorities, the Commanding Officer
(Major, later Major General Sir John Dartnell), having a difficult time trying to obtain
arms and equipment. In 1894 the title was changed to the Natal Police.

When Shepstone annexed the Transvaal in 1877, Sub-Inspector Phillips, with 25 NMP,
formed the sole escort. 26 men of the Natal Mounted Police were killed at
Isandlwana. Later in the War, part if the unit took part in the hunt for Cetshwayo and
part joined Baker Russell’s Column in pacifying North Western Zululand in
August/September 1879.

Post Zulu War the Natal Mounted Police took part in both the Basutoland and 1st Boer Wars.


Copy paperwork, rolls and research included

Please note delivery is UK only.
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1879graves

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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptySun Aug 04, 2019 6:52 pm

Hi Victorian Dad

I do not know much about medals but I would be very wary about the clasp.
The medal was on Ebay back in 2011 without a clasp. Now it has an unofficial clasp.
This is my opinion only, someone has added the clasp to add value to the medal since 2011.

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Salute


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90th

90th


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PostSubject: Medals to the NMP   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyMon Aug 05, 2019 2:34 am

Hi All
Trooper W Charlesworth , along with his brother Thomas ( who was drowned near the town of Adelaide River , South of Darwin in Australia's Northern Territory ) were two of 89 NMP personal who filled the Role of Headquarters Staff and Reservists , who therefore never crossed the Border into Zululand , and were awarded the Medal without Clasp , this list of 89 is in Forsythe's Medal Roll , and also in Dutton's ' Forgotten Heroes , and Terry Sole's ' For God , Queen and Colony '.
90th Salute
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ADMIN

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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyTue Aug 06, 2019 9:24 am

http://www.jagermedals.com/_pdf_files/army_pdfs/j2298_large.pdf
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https://www.1879zuluwar.com
Victorian Dad

Victorian Dad


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PostSubject: Re: Medals to the Natal Mounted Police   Medals to the Natal Mounted Police EmptyWed Aug 07, 2019 3:01 pm

Thanks for all the advice and tips chaps.

I suspect the photograph "of him" has been added as well?



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