Latest topics | » The Pictorial World - March 15th 1879![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Yesterday at 1:13 pm by ben2000 » The lost diary of Pvt James Owen![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 25, 2024 12:03 pm by miklew » Last of the 24th at Isandhlwana![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 24, 2024 6:16 pm by John Young » What was the uniform of field marshals/generals in the zulu war?![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Jul 22, 2024 6:53 am by John Young » Henderson and the NNH at Rorke's Drift ![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Jul 20, 2024 12:17 pm by SRB1965 » Capt. D. Hayes 1/3rd Regt., NNC![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 18, 2024 11:11 am by Julian Whybra » The Wrecked Camp![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 17, 2024 4:33 pm by Julian Whybra » Private N/N John Robert Branch 90th Regiment and his discovered diary![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Jul 15, 2024 8:53 pm by 1879graves » Private John Scott 24th Regiment a fugitive at large![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 12:06 pm by 1879graves » 90th foot sgt T. Collins 214![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 10:57 am by johnman » Baron Von Steitencron![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 10, 2024 3:10 pm by Julian Whybra » Sgt Joseph Windridge, Defender of Rorke's Drift - Memorial![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Jul 09, 2024 3:15 am by 90th » Writing advice![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 07, 2024 4:04 pm by Julian Whybra » South Africa 1877-79, 1 clasp, 1877-8-9 (4389 Fr. Sergt. S. Smith. O/2. Bde. R.A.)![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 07, 2024 9:30 am by rai » The trashing of the Zulu monument to the brave warriors at Isandlawana March 12, 2024 has been blamed on scrap metal scavengers.![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:41 pm by ADMIN» The Goodwill Zulu Festival: Celebrating the Welsh and KwaZulu Natal Shared Heritage.![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:27 pm by ADMIN» Any nominal role of G Coy 2/24th regiment ![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 11:18 am by Wayne » Bassage Diary![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 9:31 am by Julian Whybra » Prior to Sihayo's Kraal ![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 9:19 am by 90th » British Fort Locations![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 3:40 am by 90th » Sergeant 1064 Tom Hick / Hicks G Company 2/24th Regiment![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 03, 2024 11:05 am by Julian Whybra » A Hungarian soldier in the Zulu War (?)![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jun 28, 2024 2:31 pm by Mr M. Cooper » Private 25B/279 Henry Sears Bugler E Company 24th Reg. KIA Isandlwana![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 27, 2024 1:07 pm by gardner1879 » Hamilton Browne's birthday![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jun 21, 2024 9:22 am by Julian Whybra » Zulu "Corps"![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 20, 2024 6:01 pm by Hobbes » Army Pay Department Personnel![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 20, 2024 11:49 am by Julian Whybra » Ntshingwayo birth date![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jun 16, 2024 11:37 am by Hobbes » Zibhebhu and Cetshwayo's family![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:11 pm by Julian Whybra » Smith's Store/Hotel![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jun 05, 2024 6:06 pm by Julian Whybra » Corporal James Frowen Williams F Company. ![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Jun 04, 2024 5:20 pm by Julian Whybra » Shaka iLembe![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Jun 01, 2024 1:27 pm by Jon84 » Bugler 1415 Thomas Finn / Flin 90th Regiment ![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat May 25, 2024 11:28 am by johnman » Inspector-General Evelyn Richard Hugh Pollard![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue May 14, 2024 10:13 am by ADMIN» Alfred Fairlie Henderson photographs.![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat May 11, 2024 8:01 am by Julian Whybra » Fairlie's Native Police![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu May 02, 2024 9:12 pm by Hobbes |
July 2024 | Mon | Tue | Wed | Thu | Fri | Sat | Sun |
---|
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | 30 | 31 | | | | | Calendar |
|
Top posting users this month | |
New topics | » The Pictorial World - March 15th 1879![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Yesterday at 1:13 pm by ben2000 » The lost diary of Pvt James Owen![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 25, 2024 12:03 pm by miklew » Last of the 24th at Isandhlwana![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 24, 2024 5:53 pm by miklew » What was the uniform of field marshals/generals in the zulu war?![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 21, 2024 12:30 pm by darthvaix » Henderson and the NNH at Rorke's Drift ![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jul 19, 2024 1:29 pm by SRB1965 » Capt. D. Hayes 1/3rd Regt., NNC![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 17, 2024 10:52 pm by Julian Whybra » The Wrecked Camp![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 8:51 am by 61MECH » The trashing of the Zulu monument to the brave warriors at Isandlawana March 12, 2024 has been blamed on scrap metal scavengers.![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:41 pm by ADMIN» The Goodwill Zulu Festival: Celebrating the Welsh and KwaZulu Natal Shared Heritage.![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:27 pm by ADMIN |
Zero tolerance to harassment and bullying. |
Due to recent events on this forum, we have now imposed a zero tolerance to harassment and bullying. All reports will be treated seriously, and will lead to a permanent ban of both membership and IP address.
Any member blatantly corresponding in a deliberate and provoking manner will be removed from the forum as quickly as possible after the event.
If any members are being harassed behind the scenes PM facility by any member/s here at 1879zuluwar.com please do not hesitate to forward the offending text.
We are all here to communicate and enjoy the various discussions and information on the Anglo Zulu War of 1879. Opinions will vary, you will agree and disagree with one another, we will have debates, and so it goes.
There is no excuse for harassment or bullying of anyone by another person on this site.
The above applies to the main frame areas of the forum.
The ring which is the last section on the forum, is available to those members who wish to partake in slagging matches. That section cannot be viewed by guests and only viewed by members that wish to do so. |
Fair Use Notice | Fair use notice.
This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner.
We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes.
We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website.
If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution. |
| | Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana | |
| | Author | Message |
---|
gardner1879
![gardner1879](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/3201-48.jpg)
Posts : 3460 Join date : 2021-01-04
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Tue Apr 11, 2023 4:47 pm | |
| [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] Uxbridge & W. Drayton Gazette - Saturday 06 October 1883 |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Tim Needham
![Tim Needham](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/689-22.jpg)
Posts : 305 Join date : 2011-10-18 Location : Cornwall
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Tue Apr 11, 2023 9:34 pm | |
| Article relating to the now missing plaque: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | gardner1879
![gardner1879](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/3201-48.jpg)
Posts : 3460 Join date : 2021-01-04
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Wed Apr 12, 2023 7:08 am | |
| Outstanding work Tim Thank you |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Julian Whybra
Posts : 4021 Join date : 2011-09-12 Location : Billericay, Essex
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Wed Apr 12, 2023 9:05 pm | |
| Tim Can I ask you to double-check Daniel Gordon's date of attestation. I have it as 6.12.1875, the link has it as 6.12.1877. I am sure there's been a slip of the finger when typing. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Tim Needham
![Tim Needham](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/689-22.jpg)
Posts : 305 Join date : 2011-10-18 Location : Cornwall
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Wed Apr 12, 2023 9:16 pm | |
| Evening Julian,
It looks like the 1877 date has come from Paul King (either that or it's a typo as you say). I'm away from home at present so can't check 'The Noble 24th' - I'm sure someone else on here has a copy which they wouldn't mind consulting?
Regards,
Tim |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Julian Whybra
Posts : 4021 Join date : 2011-09-12 Location : Billericay, Essex
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Wed Apr 12, 2023 10:43 pm | |
| Holme's Silver Wreath has 1877 but his Noble 24th has 1875. I've seen the papers twice(in the 80s and in the noughties) and my notes say 1875 but I also have the notes from three other well-known researchers and they say 1875 too. Of course we could all have made the same mistake but I think it's more likely that Paul King has made the error. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Tim Needham
![Tim Needham](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/689-22.jpg)
Posts : 305 Join date : 2011-10-18 Location : Cornwall
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Thu Apr 13, 2023 8:05 am | |
| The Silver Wreath is referenced at the bottom of the article, so it appears that this is indeed where the 1877 date has come from.
Regards,
Tim |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Julian Whybra
Posts : 4021 Join date : 2011-09-12 Location : Billericay, Essex
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Thu Apr 13, 2023 8:33 am | |
| So it is. Will you let Paul know? |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | SRB1965
![SRB1965](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/2457-70.png)
Posts : 1225 Join date : 2017-05-13 Age : 59 Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Wed Feb 14, 2024 9:01 pm | |
| I've been looking at Gurneys.....
Two 2 James Gurney's were born in Watford of around the right age (Q3 63 and Q4 64)....I suspect from the same extended family, given the family name (James).
James and Caroline (Gurney) had 3 children (Charlotte, James and Charles)....
A Charlotte Gurney baptised her son (James) in Feb 1865.
In 1871, James Gurney (looks like aged 6) was living with his Grandparents (James and Caroline) - so at first glance it looks like James was illegitimate and something happened to Charlotte and James ended up with granny and grandad.
I can't find a death of Charlotte at the moment or record of her marrying after the birth of James but it would appear that she was working as a servant in Surrey in 1871, which could explain why James was living with Granny and Grandad.
It's possible that she married in 1875 but being as this is outside the story, I haven't researched it in too much depth.
Granny Gurney died in 1872, Grandad Gurney appears to be still going in 1881 but he was a 'border/lodger' whereas before he was living in a house.
This is only a preliminary snoop but it could explain why James ended up in a workhouse and it puts his age in Jan 1879 as 15 or 16 (depending on which 'James' but I suspect the Q4 64 one - so the younger age). I have based this on the closest one to the baptism date (but it may not be correct)
This is slightly at odds with his age at enlistment but historically many people would not know their date of birth....year (yes), month (maybe/probably) but not always the actual day and he could have lied about his age.
Technically he should have had written consent (from a parent or guardian) for him to enlist but I'm not sure how the workhouse affected this or if 'Grandad' Gurney gave
This gives an age of two potential Gurneys and a reason why one ended up in a workhouse. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Julian Whybra
Posts : 4021 Join date : 2011-09-12 Location : Billericay, Essex
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Thu Feb 15, 2024 9:28 am | |
| 25B/1494 Boy James Gurney: D coy 2/24th, attested 20th December 1877 'aged 15' (his actual age at attestation was 14; his birth was registered in the July quarter 1863 in Watford). Thus he was 15 on 22nd January. It was the much-missed Stephen Reinstadtler who found and identified him in the birth register. This is all noted in Zulu Studies Vol. V p. 73. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Julian Whybra
Posts : 4021 Join date : 2011-09-12 Location : Billericay, Essex
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Thu Feb 15, 2024 9:44 am | |
| SRB It is interesting to look at the 1871 Census survey. It looks as though the enumerator was given the erroneous age of 66 (probably by the grandfather in referring to himself). It was then crossed out and overwritten with a 7, which rendered the entry unclear. The enumerator then emphasized the final 6 of the 66 as being close enough. The whole entry had by this time become messy and unclear. 7 would of course have been the boy's correct age at the time of the Census. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | SRB1965
![SRB1965](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/2457-70.png)
Posts : 1225 Join date : 2017-05-13 Age : 59 Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Thu Feb 15, 2024 10:33 am | |
| Hiya
Yes the 71 census is a right mess. Grandad Gurney was 76 in 1881.
I favoured the second Gurney based on the baptism date and the mothers name at the baptism. Of course a Feb 65 baptism doesn't 'eliminate' a Q3 63 birth.....and based on the theory of why the Q4 64 JG could have been in a workhouse.
I suppose if it mattered much, I could follow the 'other' Gurney (who lived happily everafter - if that is possible in Watford) and see who his parents were - though I would suspect he was a cousin of Isandlwana Gurney
Studies V? It would have saved me an hour or so, if I'd looked in there.....I really must start to read things.....
Talking of which, do you have any news on the publication date of the next Studies edition - not that I'd read it or remember if I had.
Thanks
Simon |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Julian Whybra
Posts : 4021 Join date : 2011-09-12 Location : Billericay, Essex
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Thu Feb 15, 2024 5:47 pm | |
| SRB I'm tempted to say that I've forgotten but it's chugging along (I never hurry things) and will be out this year. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | SRB1965
![SRB1965](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/2457-70.png)
Posts : 1225 Join date : 2017-05-13 Age : 59 Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Thu Feb 15, 2024 6:05 pm | |
| Thanks, I promise when I get a copy, I will read it from cover to cover.....and not just look at the maps and illustrations...... ![:slight_smile: 🙂](https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/emojione/assets/png/1f642.png?v=2.2.7) |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Julian Whybra
Posts : 4021 Join date : 2011-09-12 Location : Billericay, Essex
![Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:26 am | |
| What? Not even the coloured ones? |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | | Watford band boys killed at iSandlwana | |
|
Similar topics | ![+](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) |
|
| Permissions in this forum: | You cannot reply to topics in this forum
| |
| |
| |