WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM

Film Zulu quote: Reverend Otto Witt: One thousand British soldiers have been massacred. While I stood here talking peace, a war has started.
 
HomeHome  GalleryGallery  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  
Latest topics
» KEYNSHAMLIGHTHORSE GRAVES WEBSITE
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyYesterday at 1:54 pm by rai

» William De Passey, 17th Lancers.1879.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Sep 26, 2020 7:38 pm by 1879graves

» Regimental numbers
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Sep 25, 2020 12:55 pm by Frank Allewell

» Lance Corporal Robert Eaton NMP
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Sep 25, 2020 11:25 am by Frank Allewell

» Isandlwana, Last Stands
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Sep 25, 2020 9:13 am by Julian Whybra

» Colour of Lord Chelsmford eyes
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Sep 25, 2020 8:05 am by Simonsole

» List of identified bodies at Isandlwana
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyThu Sep 17, 2020 5:30 am by John Young

» Defenders of Rorkes Drift
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyWed Sep 16, 2020 6:47 pm by Digger

» Colour Sgt Anthony Clark Booth, VC.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Sep 15, 2020 6:47 pm by ADMIN

» Cpl John Lyons
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Sep 14, 2020 7:49 pm by Bill8183

» A Case of Mistaken Identity?
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Sep 14, 2020 11:29 am by John Young

» What happened next
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Sep 14, 2020 10:51 am by Springbok

» Surgeon Espine Charles Ward
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyWed Sep 09, 2020 9:38 am by John Young

» 2nd Lieutenant William Lancelot James, 2nd/4th Regiment.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Sep 07, 2020 2:41 pm by ADMIN

» Explaining Amabutho in one word??
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Sep 07, 2020 11:49 am by SRB1965

» Non-Combat Casualties - Royal Navy and Royal Marines
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyThu Sep 03, 2020 4:05 pm by Frank Allewell

» Non-Combat Casualties - Royal Artillery
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyWed Sep 02, 2020 8:01 pm by Catiline63

» Colonel William,Egerton Saunders, C.B
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 10:46 pm by ADMIN

» Lieutenant-Colonel David Campbell Williamson.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 10:32 pm by ADMIN

» Brigade Surgeon E. J. Boulton
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 10:02 pm by ADMIN

» Joseph Walter O’Malley Martin. Assistant Surgeon
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 9:52 pm by ADMIN

» Quarter-Master William London
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 9:32 pm by ADMIN

» Surgeon Major Henry Lamb
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 9:19 pm by ADMIN

» Lieutenant Robert Thomas Graves Lowry
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 9:13 pm by ADMIN

» Sgt. John Philip Archbell NNC
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 8:43 pm by ADMIN

» Tpr. John Ross Natal Carbineer
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 8:27 pm by ADMIN

» Non-Combat Casualties in Colonial and Native Units
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 30, 2020 11:52 am by Julian Whybra

» Victorian HMS SHAH South Africa Zulu Wars Medal William Morrison Royal Navy
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 28, 2020 5:50 pm by Petty Officer Tom

» South African 1879 Zulu War medal to Corp R Starkey 57th Regiment of Foot
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 28, 2020 3:50 pm by 1879graves

» 2/4th Foot at Hlobane/Kambula
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 28, 2020 4:12 am by 90th

» England's Sons 9th edition
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyWed Aug 26, 2020 6:20 pm by Herbie

» Strange tales from Isandlwana
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Aug 23, 2020 4:25 pm by SRB1965

» Colour - Sergeant George William Mabin
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 5:48 pm by Visitor

» Militaria Sale
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Aug 18, 2020 5:59 pm by Frank Allewell

» Men of the 24th Regiment of Foot - Secunderabad, India 1873
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Aug 18, 2020 12:48 am by 90th

Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
Black as Hell, Thick as Grass
Top posters
90th
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Frank Allewell
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
littlehand
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
ADMIN
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
1879graves
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
rusteze
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Chelmsfordthescapegoat
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
John
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Mr M. Cooper
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Julian Whybra
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Top posting users this month
John Young
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Frank Allewell
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
De Passey
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
90th
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
1879graves
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
ADMIN
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Kenny
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
SRB1965
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Simonsole
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
rai
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Most active topics
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Durnford was he capable.1
Durnford was he capable. 4
Durnford was he capable.5
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The ammunition question
Durnford was he capable. 3
Durnford was he capable.2
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Most Viewed Topics
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Adding to the Library
The ammunition question
Recent Members To The ZULU WAR 1879 Discussion & Reference Forum ( A Small Victorian War in 1879)
ISANDLWANA SURVIVIORS
Durnford was he capable.5
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Lieutenant Adendorff 1-3 N.N.C.
Fair Use Notice
Fair use notice. This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner. We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website. If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution.
Keywords
taylor henry Isandlwana 24th smith martini payne horse Russell william Durnford melvill Mounted zulu George spalding Natal Franklin Police harford james gardner Prince john Woolfryes drift

 

 Victorian telescopes.

Go down 
AuthorMessage
John

John

Posts : 2558
Join date : 2009-04-06
Age : 58
Location : UK

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 13, 2010 12:14 am

I was looking at some old Victorian telescopes today. I use one to look down the high street. (Not that impressed) But it dawn that Milne must of used one similar. Which suggests to me that he would not have got a very good view of Isandlwana, The standard magnification in those days was only about 4X, which is ok for bird watching in your back garden. I’m no expert on telescopes, but the guy who was selling them seemed to be. And also the glass used was not tinted so the glare from the Sun (If the sun was in the direction Milne was looking would have been near impossible to see anything of Isandlwana.

Just a few question’s for clarification.

1)How far was Milne from Isandlwana?
2)Would the sun have been behind him, or in front or other?
3)Would there have been ground mist, haziness?
4)Was Isandlwana visable with the naked eye from the location used by Milne.

My take on how he saw Isandlwana on that day. Idea

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Back to top Go down
Dave

Dave

Posts : 1605
Join date : 2009-09-21

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Re: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 13, 2010 12:30 am

John. This relating to Milne court of Inquiry

"Lieutenant Milne, R.N., A.D.C., shortly after this descended a hill on our left, whence he had been on the look-out with a telescope. All the news he gave regarding the camp was that the cattle had been driven into camp. I believe this to have been nearly 11 A.M"

Source:Northeastmedals.
Back to top Go down
90th

90th

Posts : 10136
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: victorian telescopes   Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 13, 2010 5:06 am

hi john.
This is from Ian Knights ' Zulu - Isandlwana & Rorkes Drift 22-23 January 1879 '
Chelmsford sent Lt. Milne and Capt. W. Penn Symons of the 24th up a hill on the left to look at the camp through
their glasses , Reported Milne .... ' On reaching the summit I could see the camp ; all the cattle had been driven in close
around the tents , I could see nothing of the enemy on the left . The main body of the enemy who had been on our front all
morning , were now assembled at the foot of Siphezi Hill , watching the movements of the mounted infantry , who were scouring
the plain some short distance off , but on their apprach they all retreated to the table - land on top of the ( Siphezi ) mountain.
I also saw small clusters of the enemy on every hill top around us , observing our movements . Distinct firing was heard at small
intervals in the direction of the mounted police ' .
Ian Knight continues ........ Exactly how much could Milne have seen from his position ? , Isandlwana is clearly visible 12 miles away
across the plain from Mangeni , and at a quick glance it seems improbable that anyone with a good glass could have missed signs
of a battle taking place at its foot . Yet the mountain itself IS BELOW THE SKYLINE , and the distant hills of Natal beyond camouflage
its outline , while any mist or heat haze would obscure objects at its foot . The white blur of the tents would probably have been clear
enough ; for the rest , Milne would have had to interpret a few dark smudges according to whatever circumstances he thought most
likely . Since no member of the staff expected anything unusual to be taking place at the camp , Milne assumed that the dark patches near the tents were cattle . He was later forced to admit that he may have been wrong in that judgement .
On page 49 of this book is a photo taken to the left of the Milne position , on the nek between Hlazakazi and Mdutshane , where a
number of officers looked back toward the camp . The photo was taken with a 200mm telephoto lens to simulate the effect of a telescope , Ian goes on to say , ' Although the outline of Isandlwana is dimly visible below the horizon it is impossible to discern any
detail of what lies at its base ' . Hope this helps .
cheers 90th.

ps. I forgot to mention , there could have been haziness but more likely the white smoke from the firing would have made it difficult
to see , but as the foot of Isandlwana cant be seen from this position the smoke mightnt have been seen . Milne wasnt looking directly
into the sun , but it was in his front .


Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7591
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 73
Location : Cape Town South Africa

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Re: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 13, 2010 3:43 pm

I would agree with 90th.
In "Then and Now" there is a photo taken from the excat position using a telephoto lense. Its very hazy, and the timing would mean that the sun had started to sink down into the west, so it would have made the haze worse. Its also a good point about the smoke.
Milne however did say the tents had not been struck, how he could see that I have no idea.

Regards
Back to top Go down
littlehand

littlehand

Posts : 7086
Join date : 2009-04-24
Age : 52
Location : Down South.

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Re: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Aug 14, 2010 12:06 am

But surly, if it was smoke then it would have been very clear, that somthing was happening. There's no smoke without fire.
Back to top Go down
90th

90th

Posts : 10136
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: victorian telescopes   Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Aug 14, 2010 1:25 am

hi littlehand.
You must remember that you cant see the foot of Isandlwana hill from where Milne was looking , so therefore
the smoke would have risen and dissipated and would have taken on the appearance of haziness . Also the
telescopes were of dubious quality to see clearly from 12 miles away . Idea
cheers 90th.
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Re: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  Empty

Back to top Go down
 
Victorian telescopes.
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM  :: GENERAL DISCUSSION AREA-
Jump to: