WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM

Film Zulu: Colour Sergeant Bourne : The sentries report Zulus to the southwest. Thousands of them.
 
HomeHome  GalleryGallery  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  
Latest topics
» New British Muzleloaders videos on Isandlwana
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyToday at 11:08 am by aussie inkosi

» Colour - Sergeant George William Mabin
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Apr 12, 2021 11:07 am by Visitor

» In Affectionate Remembrance of P.C. Stephens
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Apr 09, 2021 10:55 am by John Young

» Trpr. Simpson's medal
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyThu Apr 08, 2021 5:13 pm by Julian Whybra

» Someone maybe able to help. 2235 Pte A F Edmonds J7th DCOLrg
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyThu Apr 08, 2021 3:30 am by 90th

» Medal ribbon on Patrol Jacket
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Apr 04, 2021 9:47 pm by John Young

» Zulu War Medal
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Apr 04, 2021 6:23 pm by Kenny

» One of the lesser-known stories. It took place around the same time as Isandlwana.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Apr 04, 2021 9:54 am by Julian Whybra

» List of identified bodies at Isandlwana
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Apr 04, 2021 9:29 am by Julian Whybra

» Isandlwana Survivor photo's
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Apr 03, 2021 7:06 pm by ADMIN

» <Pte. W. Dunne 2nd Btn 3rd (East Kent) Regiment ('The Buffs') & Sgt. O. Hydenburg (Aydenburg) Natal Native Contingent,)
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Apr 02, 2021 1:33 pm by gardner1879

» William Papworth. Alan Gardner's servant.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyThu Apr 01, 2021 10:28 pm by gardner1879

» Smith-Dorrien 1881
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyThu Apr 01, 2021 5:45 pm by John Young

» Archibald Forbes query
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Mar 30, 2021 11:26 am by Julian Whybra

» Norris-Newman
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Mar 29, 2021 10:17 am by ADMIN

» Forum questions or problems!
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Mar 28, 2021 10:25 pm by ADMIN

» Pte Lewitt of the 58th Foot
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySun Mar 28, 2021 12:09 am by 90th

» nTshingwayo ka Mahole
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Mar 26, 2021 6:07 am by Frank Allewell

» George Astell Pardoe Lieutentant, 13th Light Infantry
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyWed Mar 24, 2021 12:13 am by 90th

» Press coverage of the Zulu King
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Mar 22, 2021 9:33 am by Frank Allewell

» Mini Series : Shaka: King of the Zulu Nation
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Mar 20, 2021 9:47 am by Frank Allewell

» Henry Felton 3/60th
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Mar 19, 2021 1:28 pm by Will M

» Pvt John Llyod 1/24th
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyWed Mar 17, 2021 7:12 pm by gardner1879

» William De Passey, 17th Lancers.1879.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyWed Mar 17, 2021 2:00 pm by 1879graves

» Natal Transport Service
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Mar 16, 2021 10:07 pm by 90th

» The Passing of His Majesty King Goodwill Zwelithini
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Mar 13, 2021 5:38 pm by Brett Hendey

» Prevost, William. Ensign. Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders
Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Mar 13, 2021 11:15 am by John Young

» 9312 Sapper H Cuthbert 5th Field Coy RE
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Mar 12, 2021 1:29 pm by ADMIN

» Zulu War to Boer war. Those who served in both.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyWed Mar 10, 2021 3:02 pm by 1879graves

» Captain Gardner's Escort
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Mar 09, 2021 10:50 pm by WeekendWarrior

» Out there from David Jackson
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Mar 09, 2021 5:20 pm by Julian Whybra

» The source of the MacKinnon & Shadbolt map discovered.
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Mar 09, 2021 2:28 am by WeekendWarrior

» Experiences During the Zulu War
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyTue Mar 09, 2021 12:25 am by Peter35

» Duck, Veterinary Colonel Francis, CB, AVD, PRCVS
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyMon Mar 08, 2021 6:12 pm by 1879graves

» 2nd Battalion, 24th (2nd Warwickshire) Regiment, September 1879
Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Mar 05, 2021 5:28 pm by Kenny

Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
Battle Of ISANDLWANA1879/01/22 Camp Over Run
Top posters
90th
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Frank Allewell
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
littlehand
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
ADMIN
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
1879graves
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
rusteze
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Chelmsfordthescapegoat
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
John
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Mr M. Cooper
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Julian Whybra
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Top posting users this month
Julian Whybra
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
gardner1879
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Frank Allewell
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
90th
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
John Young
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
aussie inkosi
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Kenny
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Shaun Winkler
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Visitor
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
ADMIN
Victorian telescopes.  Bar_leftVictorian telescopes.  BarVictorian telescopes.  Bar_right 
Most active topics
Durnford was he capable.1
Durnford was he capable. 4
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Durnford was he capable.5
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The ammunition question
Durnford was he capable. 3
Durnford was he capable.2
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Most Viewed Topics
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Adding to the Library
The ammunition question
Recent Members To The ZULU WAR 1879 Discussion & Reference Forum ( A Small Victorian War in 1879)
ISANDLWANA SURVIVIORS
Durnford was he capable.5
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Lieutenant Adendorff 1-3 N.N.C.
Fair Use Notice
Fair use notice. This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner. We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website. If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution.
Keywords
james john martini Mounted Forbes spalding payne Russell drift Franklin harford zulu Prince Durnford Police henry smith Woolfryes carbineers melvill 24th horse George taylor Natal Isandlwana
 

 Victorian telescopes.

Go down 
AuthorMessage
John

John

Posts : 2558
Join date : 2009-04-06
Age : 58
Location : UK

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 13, 2010 12:14 am

I was looking at some old Victorian telescopes today. I use one to look down the high street. (Not that impressed) But it dawn that Milne must of used one similar. Which suggests to me that he would not have got a very good view of Isandlwana, The standard magnification in those days was only about 4X, which is ok for bird watching in your back garden. I’m no expert on telescopes, but the guy who was selling them seemed to be. And also the glass used was not tinted so the glare from the Sun (If the sun was in the direction Milne was looking would have been near impossible to see anything of Isandlwana.

Just a few question’s for clarification.

1)How far was Milne from Isandlwana?
2)Would the sun have been behind him, or in front or other?
3)Would there have been ground mist, haziness?
4)Was Isandlwana visable with the naked eye from the location used by Milne.

My take on how he saw Isandlwana on that day. Idea

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Back to top Go down
Dave

Dave

Posts : 1604
Join date : 2009-09-21

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Re: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 13, 2010 12:30 am

John. This relating to Milne court of Inquiry

"Lieutenant Milne, R.N., A.D.C., shortly after this descended a hill on our left, whence he had been on the look-out with a telescope. All the news he gave regarding the camp was that the cattle had been driven into camp. I believe this to have been nearly 11 A.M"

Source:Northeastmedals.
Back to top Go down
90th

90th

Posts : 10256
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: victorian telescopes   Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 13, 2010 5:06 am

hi john.
This is from Ian Knights ' Zulu - Isandlwana & Rorkes Drift 22-23 January 1879 '
Chelmsford sent Lt. Milne and Capt. W. Penn Symons of the 24th up a hill on the left to look at the camp through
their glasses , Reported Milne .... ' On reaching the summit I could see the camp ; all the cattle had been driven in close
around the tents , I could see nothing of the enemy on the left . The main body of the enemy who had been on our front all
morning , were now assembled at the foot of Siphezi Hill , watching the movements of the mounted infantry , who were scouring
the plain some short distance off , but on their apprach they all retreated to the table - land on top of the ( Siphezi ) mountain.
I also saw small clusters of the enemy on every hill top around us , observing our movements . Distinct firing was heard at small
intervals in the direction of the mounted police ' .
Ian Knight continues ........ Exactly how much could Milne have seen from his position ? , Isandlwana is clearly visible 12 miles away
across the plain from Mangeni , and at a quick glance it seems improbable that anyone with a good glass could have missed signs
of a battle taking place at its foot . Yet the mountain itself IS BELOW THE SKYLINE , and the distant hills of Natal beyond camouflage
its outline , while any mist or heat haze would obscure objects at its foot . The white blur of the tents would probably have been clear
enough ; for the rest , Milne would have had to interpret a few dark smudges according to whatever circumstances he thought most
likely . Since no member of the staff expected anything unusual to be taking place at the camp , Milne assumed that the dark patches near the tents were cattle . He was later forced to admit that he may have been wrong in that judgement .
On page 49 of this book is a photo taken to the left of the Milne position , on the nek between Hlazakazi and Mdutshane , where a
number of officers looked back toward the camp . The photo was taken with a 200mm telephoto lens to simulate the effect of a telescope , Ian goes on to say , ' Although the outline of Isandlwana is dimly visible below the horizon it is impossible to discern any
detail of what lies at its base ' . Hope this helps .
cheers 90th.

ps. I forgot to mention , there could have been haziness but more likely the white smoke from the firing would have made it difficult
to see , but as the foot of Isandlwana cant be seen from this position the smoke mightnt have been seen . Milne wasnt looking directly
into the sun , but it was in his front .


Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7728
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 74
Location : Cape Town South Africa

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Re: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  EmptyFri Aug 13, 2010 3:43 pm

I would agree with 90th.
In "Then and Now" there is a photo taken from the excat position using a telephoto lense. Its very hazy, and the timing would mean that the sun had started to sink down into the west, so it would have made the haze worse. Its also a good point about the smoke.
Milne however did say the tents had not been struck, how he could see that I have no idea.

Regards
Back to top Go down
littlehand

littlehand

Posts : 7077
Join date : 2009-04-24
Age : 52
Location : Down South.

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: Re: Victorian telescopes.    Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Aug 14, 2010 12:06 am

But surly, if it was smoke then it would have been very clear, that somthing was happening. There's no smoke without fire.
Back to top Go down
90th

90th

Posts : 10256
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

Victorian telescopes.  Empty
PostSubject: victorian telescopes   Victorian telescopes.  EmptySat Aug 14, 2010 1:25 am

hi littlehand.
You must remember that you cant see the foot of Isandlwana hill from where Milne was looking , so therefore
the smoke would have risen and dissipated and would have taken on the appearance of haziness . Also the
telescopes were of dubious quality to see clearly from 12 miles away . Idea
cheers 90th.
Back to top Go down
 
Victorian telescopes.
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM  :: GENERAL DISCUSSION AREA-
Jump to: