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Lord Chelmsford Said .Buller is ‘one of the finest soldiers of the century’, so modest and reticent –that it was difficult to say for what individual deed he had got the Victoria Cross as he had been doing acts worthy of it all along the line
 
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 Lt Antsey and men on road repairs

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ChrisHughes



Posts : 5
Join date : 2011-07-30
Age : 62
Location : Malaysia

Lt Antsey and men on road repairs Empty
PostSubject: Lt Antsey and men on road repairs   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptyFri Aug 12, 2011 2:18 pm

Sorry I am new to the forum and not sure of protocols. Have read everything I can get my hands on for the past 20 years, especially re Isandlwana.
Question is I recently saw some photos of cairns on the "fugitives trail" supposed to be remains of 24th, Lt Antsey's men, who I have read were sent out early in the day on road repairs.
Did they make it back to the line - as I also read a runner was sent early in the picture to retrieve them - or is it known that they died retreating down the trail?
Also, I have read that a significant proportion of the Imperial Infantry died either on or over the Nek?
Any comments (and advice on protocols in the forum) appreciated.
Chris H
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Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7507
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 73
Location : Cape Town South Africa

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PostSubject: Re: Lt Antsey and men on road repairs   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptyFri Aug 12, 2011 3:02 pm

Hi Chris and welcome.
Protocols?
Enjoy yourself, robust debate is good, no bad language and no personal attacks.

Otherwise take part in the discussions, ask questions give opinions and have fun.

Learn and share.

Thats about it really.

In terms of Anstey.............. its so debatable( like most things at isandlwana), as to where the fatigue party was working. There is evidence that suggests they were working in front of the camp along the road that Chelmsford used in his advance.He was in the firing line and retreated back along the mountain face to the neck and then a fighting retreat down the mountain reverse to his final point on the stream. If you look on Google earth here are a cluster of cairns right on the banks of the stream. Ansteys body was found there.
Have a look at Jammies site, there is a link below left. It shows the trail and the progression of the cairns. It was likened as a string with knots stretching down to the stream, Norris Newman I think.
Probably the greatest number of cairns/graves are in the region of the 1/24 th tent area and the wagon park stretching over the neck and then down towards the fugitives trail.

Explore this site there are lots of threads dealing with Anstey and the Fugitives trail itself.

Regards

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littlehand

littlehand

Posts : 7086
Join date : 2009-04-24
Age : 51
Location : Down South.

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PostSubject: Re: Lt Antsey and men on road repairs   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptyFri Aug 12, 2011 9:51 pm

http://1879zuluwar.forumotion.com/t248-lieutenant-edgar-anstey-1st-battalion-24th-regiment-of-foot
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ChrisHughes



Posts : 5
Join date : 2011-07-30
Age : 62
Location : Malaysia

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PostSubject: Re: Lt Antsey and men on road repairs   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptyFri Aug 12, 2011 11:46 pm

Thanks for the info, much appreciated.
I am absolutely absorbed with the AZW, Isandlwana in particular and any info is great.
I think my interest started when I was in the military (Australian Army - Engineer Corps) and during recruit training they screened "Zulu" for us. This was in 1977 and my interest has only grown since then.
I'll have a look at the site. Cheers
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ChrisHughes



Posts : 5
Join date : 2011-07-30
Age : 62
Location : Malaysia

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PostSubject: Re: Lt Antsey and men on road repairs   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptySat Aug 13, 2011 12:12 am

Thanks again, Jamie's site fantastic info and photo's - will need a few hours to absorb.
I hadn't realised Durnford's last stand was so close to "Blacks Koppie" and so far out to the right flank.
I had imagined him closer in to the middle of the "saddle".
Also previously thought most of the 24th didn't manage a fighting retreat - my initial reading was Donald Morris, and I inferred that the 24th companies were basically overwhelmed not far from their initial positions in the line.
Think I'll need to visit Isandlwana. Cheers.
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90th

90th

Posts : 10089
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

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PostSubject: Lt Anstey and his men on road repairs    Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptySat Aug 13, 2011 12:59 am

Hi Chis .
I dont know what you've read on the war but you should read the New Ian Knight book Zulu Rising and Mike Snooks
How Can Men Die Better, not many footnotes in snook but the way he describes the battle from his mlitary point of view,
he was a Lt - Col in the Royal Reg Wales ( 24th , SW Borderer's ) is excellent . Isandlwana , must get there one day myself.
Holts Tours are running a tour through Zululand in October through November Ian Knight is leading it , they run these tours
annually .
cheers 90th
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ChrisHughes



Posts : 5
Join date : 2011-07-30
Age : 62
Location : Malaysia

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PostSubject: Re: Lt Antsey and men on road repairs   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptySat Aug 13, 2011 1:23 am

Thanks, actually have both of those books on order from Amazon.
Looking forward to getting into them and no doubt will have lot's of comments to post once read.
Note you are in Melbourne, I'm from there as well but working in Malaysia past 4 years.
Won't be able to make it this year to Isandlwana, but sounds good, I'll work on going in 2012.
Appreciate your replies. Cheers.
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ymob

ymob

Posts : 2263
Join date : 2010-10-22
Location : France

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PostSubject: Anstey last stand   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptyTue Aug 16, 2011 2:09 pm

Hello Springbok9,



ANSTEY's men have retreating back to their final point near the banks of the stream.

Why did not any of them manage to cross the river?

(I am never going to Isandlwana).



Cheers



YMOB
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Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7507
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 73
Location : Cape Town South Africa

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PostSubject: Re: Lt Antsey and men on road repairs   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptyTue Aug 16, 2011 3:20 pm

YMOB
Sorry My extremely limited French doesnt allow me to put this better.

Picture in your mind the setting. A sharply sloping hill down towards a very sharp 3 to 4 meter vertical drop to the stream. Anstey and his men have fought a rear guard action all the way across the battlefield, staged a stand on the neck, quite possibly have staged another stand in an old kraal, retreated some 750 meters down the slope to the top of the bank. They are probably out of ammunition and are fighting at close quarters with bayonet. So the zulus are literally at arms length away, screaming and shouting, threatening with spears, the atmosphere would have been intense, sweat pouring out of the troops along with the raw fear. Across the stream there are hoards of zulu having chased the fugitives and are now returning. So zulus in front, a precipice behind, if the manage to jump the precipice zulus are waiting at the bottom.
There is absolutly no where to go. They did the only thing they could do, fight to the death a give a good account of themselves.

If you decide not to go to isandlwana you will be missing a unique experience, its one of the few battlefields in the world that lets you feel exactly what happened. The fugitives trail walk and a cold swim at the end crossing the drift, a staggering walk up the hill to the final resting place of M and C and a sharp walk to warm up at the bar of the Fugitives Lodge..............magical.

Try it

Regards
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ymob

ymob

Posts : 2263
Join date : 2010-10-22
Location : France

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PostSubject: Re: Lt Antsey and men on road repairs   Lt Antsey and men on road repairs EmptyTue Aug 16, 2011 4:03 pm

Hi Springbok9,



Yes!!, a resolute enigma (for me)!!!

A very clear picture and "atmosphère" of the ANSTEY's last stand!!!!

Thank you for the realistic description!



I will want to go to Isandlwana.

It's a dream.

But South africa is a very expansive travel for me (and my wife!!!).



Regards
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