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» Colonel W. P. Collingwood
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» (Lieut: R. F. Westmacott. 77th. Foot.)
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 At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 10:06 am

Hi all

At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.

Also tell me if my new friend, LC, have had time, after giving appropriate orders, for return to Isandhlwana with all the troops with him to cover himself with immortal glory ...

At what time he Would Have Left his position with all his troops to participate in the battle ?

Cheers

Pascal
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90th

90th

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Location : Melbourne, Australia

At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: At 9.30 am Pulleine's message was received by Colonel Glyn   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 12:05 pm

Hi Pascal.
We have covered this before and L.C certainly would not have had time to get back to Isandlwana once he received the first message at 9.30 am as you stated , L.C then sent his forces off looking for the whereabouts of the zulu army . We know that other messages were sent and LC said he didnt receive them , I think Clery got Pulleines second message and according to Morris he didnt pass it on to L.C . Lets not forget Hamilton - Browne who also said he sent 4 messages to LC who never replied to any of them because LC said he never received them. Luckily LC didnt try and return to the camp because more than likely he'd have been chopped like the camp.
90th.
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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 12:40 pm

Hi Gary

And if LC had anyway, tried a forced march to join the camps !

At what time, at the latest, he would have arrived at Isandhlwana ?

Cheers

Pascal
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90th

90th

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: At 9.30 am Pulleine's message was received by Col Glyn   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 12:45 pm

Hi Pascal '
My best guess is had LC tried to return to the camp he would've been in time to become the Entree !!!!. :lol:
Cheers 90th.
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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 1:17 pm

Hi Gary

The the Entree scratch ? What is it scratch ?


No, but seriously, let him go after having given orders to his troops, he arrives at Isandhlwana before the end of the battle ?


Cheers

Pascal
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littlehand

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 2:17 pm

Pascal your starting topics all over the place. As 90th states this is being covered in the other thread! These question are all relevant to the Durnford was he capable.
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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 2:24 pm

This is not exactly the same thing from this angle there ...
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90th

90th

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: 9-30 am Pulleine's message was received by Glyn    At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 8:51 pm

Hi Pascal.
The Entree is what you have when you go out for dinner , before you have the main course , its also known as a starter ! .
Cheers 90th. :lol:
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tasker224

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyMon Nov 26, 2012 11:30 pm

It would have taken LC's column about the same time to march to the camp, as it would have taken Pulleine and his camp column to march to Mangeni.
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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyTue Nov 27, 2012 7:00 am

interestingTasker , because if Pulleine was attacked in the open, perhaps immediately, he would have to take a appropriate defensive formation ... It is to say a great big square...
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tasker224

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyTue Nov 27, 2012 7:23 pm

Square it is Pascal! Salute
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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyWed Nov 28, 2012 8:23 am

Yes, Tasker ,in this situation, I hope they would have the idea pretty quickly, of forming a square
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tasker224

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyWed Nov 28, 2012 10:40 pm

Pascal, not saying they should or even could have formed a square; after a couple of years in the Cape, their cavalry tactics would have become a little unpractised and rusty.
With the square, this is purely a hypothetical tactic with ALL the benefit of hindsight.
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Dave

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyWed Nov 28, 2012 11:11 pm

Proved to be ok at "Ulundi"
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Chelmsfordthescapegoat

Chelmsfordthescapegoat

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyThu Nov 29, 2012 4:50 am

Right you are Dave. Salute
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90th

90th

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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: At 9.30 am Pulleine's message was received by Col Glyn    At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyThu Nov 29, 2012 6:08 am

Dave
Your quote '' Proved to be ok at Ulundi '' . Well of course it did , like it also did at Kambula & Gingindlovu because of the lessons that were learnt after Isandlwana , in your reference to Ulundi , you do need to remember that there were 3 times, possibly more , the amount of guns in use at Ulundi than at Isandlwana and they also had Regular Cavalry and Gatling Guns which weren't available at Isandlwana . Agree with Tasker , the square talk is all with the benefit of hindsight , Littlehands least favourite word . But , what else is it ??. No mention of squares in LC standing orders , he actually states that formation is not to be used . Shocked Funny , how after Isandlwana he goes square happy ! Shocked Why , because he had the benefit of hindsight and learnt from the previous mistakes . Sorry CTSG , this is for you also . Very Happy
90th.
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At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. Empty
PostSubject: Re: At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn.   At 9:30am Pulleine’s message was received by Colonel Glyn. EmptyThu Nov 29, 2012 7:07 am

Yes the square or the laager was never mentioned by LC in tactical instructions or orders before Isandhlwana !

It has had Isandhlwana. is so well entrenched for Kambula, it is because he had heard of RD ...

And if wood has not taken his British infantry for Hlobana, it is believed that with his horsemen he could maneuvrer the Zulus.

And he knew that 15 companies, even in square, discovered in Zululand, it was not enough to stop the Zulu royal army ...

Faced 20,000 Zulu, it takes 25 British imperial infantry companies ...

Cheers

Pascal
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