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Film Zulu quote: Reverend Otto Witt: One thousand British soldiers have been massacred. While I stood here talking peace, a war has started.
 
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 Zulu Victory - Views?

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Drummer Boy 14

Drummer Boy 14

Posts : 1998
Join date : 2011-08-01
Age : 23

Zulu Victory - Views?  Empty
PostSubject: Zulu Victory - Views?    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyThu Jun 25, 2020 3:05 pm

Hi all,

I was wondering what members views are on the book Zulu Victory?

I myself find the works of Jackson, Knight and Snook to be the best three accounts of Isandlwana with Jackson's being the most important. When I read Zulu Victory I was disappointed with the high number of basic errors over the ammunition myth and putting the wrong Lt with the H company stand for example. I found the overall book not very useful when compared to the ones i mentioned above so would be interested to hear other people's views on this and the books they judge to be the most useful.

Many thanks,
Sam

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ciroferrara

ciroferrara

Posts : 224
Join date : 2010-10-07
Age : 29
Location : exeter

Zulu Victory - Views?  Empty
PostSubject: Re: Zulu Victory - Views?    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyThu Jun 25, 2020 6:47 pm

In some ways I found it highly readable but I find that hill of the sphinx and Zulu rising were easily the best two books.. not too keen on snook. Zulu victory had it's merits, read almost novel like.
Ciroferrara

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90th

90th

Posts : 10136
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 64
Location : Melbourne, Australia

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PostSubject: Zulu Victory - Views    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyThu Jun 25, 2020 6:55 pm

Hi Sam
I read Z.Victory many years ago , don't really remember it being earth shattering , but I do think it's worth having , agree with Ciroferrara , ' Hill Of The Sphinx ' and ' Zulu Rising ' as excellent books on Isandlwana , Snook's book is a great read , he describes the battle excellently , but that's what it is ....a read ! , basically no footnotes throughout the book to back up his theories , claims etc , also one I read several years ago , he's very Pro the 24th and those in it , certainly Anti Durnford , and everyone else from memory ? .
90th

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Drummer Boy 14

Drummer Boy 14

Posts : 1998
Join date : 2011-08-01
Age : 23

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Victory - Views?    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyFri Jun 26, 2020 9:38 am

Hi Ciroferrara, 90th,

I agree with you both here. Jackson's work is a must read and Knight's Zulu Rising is great also.

I think anyone looking at Isandlwana should read Mike Snook's book as his telling of the battle is incredible and really helps the reader understand the battle. But given his lack of foot notes it should only be read in addition to Jackson's account.

Many thanks,
Sam

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Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7586
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 73
Location : Cape Town South Africa

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Victory - Views?    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyFri Jun 26, 2020 11:45 am

Mike Snook has to be taken with a serious helping of salt. There are some serious misgivings with his loyalty overlapping known facts and modern interpretation, Pope is a classic example, his line stretching all the way to Amatutshane is another. I approached him on a few areas only to be told he had 'moved on'.
I dont always agree with Ian Knight but he sticks rock solid to known facts, very little speculation and hell he tells a good story, thats his living so he has to be good. Zulu Rising is the best all round book there is, thats not to denigate David Jackson. DJ is pure solid researched history, IK is a damn fine narrative.
In order of position on my bookshelf? DJ, IK, Noddy, Snook Shocked

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AlCapone



Posts : 3
Join date : 2019-02-21

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Victory - Views?    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyThu Jul 02, 2020 1:49 pm

Snook's understanding of the regimental system is second to none, and he is professional military which gives his thinking around command decisions a feeling of authenticity.  For example he writes quite well about terrain and how it might have impacted the battle. But his rendition of the final half hour of the fight I find to be not merely "un-footnoted" but verging on fantasy.  His is a clockwork world of besieged men who, though facing certain annihilation, maneuver with parade ground precision to the last. This contrasts with most of the surviving accounts of Zulus present on the battlefield -- though they had a great deal of incentive to please their captors. Knight's Zulu Rising is best followed closely by Jackson, IMO.  Valuable as he is in some regards, Snook's contribution does not belong in that company.
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Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell

Posts : 7586
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 73
Location : Cape Town South Africa

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Victory - Views?    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyThu Jul 02, 2020 2:47 pm

Good Summary

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Julian Whybra



Posts : 2357
Join date : 2011-09-12

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Victory - Views?    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyThu Jul 02, 2020 3:54 pm

Hi
Although I found ZV thought-provoking in many respects I have found that some quotations have been misquoted which can be deeply frustrating. Something jars...I think 'surely that's not right'...check the primary source...and it isn't right. It's happened on a number of occasions and not just with quotations but also with the order of events, times, figures. So, basically, though it's a good read, I always have to check everything.
As an aside, Jackson is no. 1.
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WeekendWarrior

WeekendWarrior

Posts : 90
Join date : 2017-07-21
Location : San Diego, CA

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PostSubject: Re: Zulu Victory - Views?    Zulu Victory - Views?  EmptyThu Jul 02, 2020 6:52 pm

I rather enjoyed Zulu Victory; although to be fair there are very few AZW books I'm not fond of. ZV presents some interesting theories and a few revelations that I haven't seen many other authors hone in on (the second attempt to save a Colour discussed by Jackson). Zulu Rising is my go-to for these events, but I really do enjoy How Can Man Die Better; it's beautifully written even if I don't agree with all the theories.

Jackson's work is visionary and in a league of its own although I unfortunately have not yet been able to track down a copy of Hill of the Sphinx within my budget! His Sources Re Examined is a must have.

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