WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM

Zulu Film Quote Lieutenant Bromhead :If 1200 men couldn't hold a defensive position this morning, what chance have we with 100?
 
HomeHome  GalleryGallery  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  
Latest topics
» Brothers Sears
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyToday at 10:20 pm by Eddie

» Striking a match
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyToday at 8:03 pm by Eddie

» Chelmsford's Main Mistake
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyToday at 10:12 am by Tig Van Milcroft

» John Ford Webster in court
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyToday at 9:40 am by rai

» Major A. H. Tylden-Pattenson, East Kent Regiment
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyToday at 9:12 am by rai

» Sergeant Major 1897 David Allan Strachan, 99th Regiment
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyToday at 9:02 am by rai

» Lieutenant- General Sir Charles Mansfield Clarke.
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyToday at 7:30 am by rai

» Take out the Officers
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 10:36 pm by Julian Whybra

» Native of Tonypandy
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 3:24 pm by Eddie

» Joseph Williams (VC) ?
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 1:46 pm by Eddie

» John Cook and his kidney problem
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 10:59 am by rai

» Acting Gunner J Mitchell HMS Active
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 10:13 am by rai

» Private 25B/968 Thomas John Moffatt 2/24th Regiment
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 10:10 am by gardner1879

» Inspector-General Evelyn Richard Hugh Pollard
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 9:25 am by rai

» Lieutenant E C Martin 87th Regiment
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 9:20 am by rai

» H M Stanley and George Henty
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 8:57 am by rai

» Private Lloyd 17th Lancers
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 8:45 am by rai

» 3rd Battn., Grenadier Guards, 1884
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 8:03 am by Kenny

» Frederick James Savery
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 7:42 am by rai

» General Richard Harrison Royal Engineers
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 1:41 am by 90th

» Captain Reginald A J Talbot 1st Life Guards
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptyYesterday at 1:37 am by 90th

» Robert Standish Sievier.
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Oct 02, 2022 3:42 pm by Eddie

» W H Field bandsman
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Oct 02, 2022 11:50 am by rai

» Sergeant 1257 James Perketh 80th Regiment
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Oct 02, 2022 11:34 am by 1879graves

» Butler, Lieutenant-General Sir William Francis Butler, KCB
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Oct 02, 2022 11:24 am by rai

» Engineer G Aborn HMS Orontes
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Oct 02, 2022 10:41 am by rai

» The Drunken "Draft" at Howick and the Mounted Infantry
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Oct 02, 2022 10:37 am by Bill8183

» All things Zulu war
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Oct 02, 2022 10:26 am by Julian Whybra

» Lieut. Walsh and the Siphezi patrol of the 21st January
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Oct 01, 2022 7:29 pm by Tig Van Milcroft

» Colour Sergeant 1681 William McLatter 2/3rd Regiment
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Oct 01, 2022 3:34 pm by gardner1879

» Photograph of Archibald B. Milne, R.N.
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Oct 01, 2022 3:23 pm by gardner1879

» Thomas Hallam drunk in court
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Oct 01, 2022 3:18 pm by gardner1879

» Commandant Schermbrucker
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Oct 01, 2022 3:07 pm by gardner1879

» Robert Elliott stabbed his wife
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Oct 01, 2022 2:59 pm by gardner1879

» John Kelly
Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Oct 01, 2022 2:55 pm by gardner1879

Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
The Death of the Prince Imperial Zulu War 1879
Top posters
90th
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Frank Allewell
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
littlehand
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
ADMIN
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
1879graves
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Julian Whybra
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
rusteze
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
John Young
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Chelmsfordthescapegoat
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
gardner1879
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Top posting users this month
gardner1879
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Eddie
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Julian Whybra
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
rai
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
John Young
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
BobTiernan
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
90th
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
1879graves
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Kenny
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Tim Needham
Strange tales from Isandlwana Bar_leftStrange tales from Isandlwana BarStrange tales from Isandlwana Bar_right 
Most active topics
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Durnford was he capable.5
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Durnford was he capable.1
Durnford was he capable. 4
The ammunition question
Durnford was he capable. 3
Durnford was he capable.2
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Most Viewed Topics
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Please Do Not Post Ads on Our Forum
Recent Members To The ZULU WAR 1879 Discussion & Reference Forum ( A Small Victorian War in 1879)
The missing five hours.
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Google Chrome new standards imposed
ISANDLWANA SURVIVIORS
Adding to the Library
The ammunition question
Durnford was he capable.5
Fair Use Notice
Fair use notice. This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner. We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website. If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution.
Keywords
john taylor Jones horse Natal Prince Woolfryes Police drift 24th brown 2022 martini henry Durnford james Roll Russell zulu smith Mounted Franklin Isandlwana harford spalding George
 

 Strange tales from Isandlwana

Go down 
3 posters
AuthorMessage
SRB1965

SRB1965


Posts : 896
Join date : 2017-05-13
Age : 57
Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 8:29 am

Hi

Jut making conversation here but has anyone every thought about the weirdest 'theory' or tale about Isandlwana from the time (I'm not talking about modern ideas but contemporary ones)?

Indulge me here.....so late on the 22nd Chelmsford returned to the camp, to move on ASAP back across the border, a number of burial parties were later sent.....

One thing I find fascinating is the 'soldiers' view of things.....so one chap finds some playing cards scattered around so says that some British were playing cards at the time of the attack.....

GBH says he saw two of his Natal Native Contingent officers (was it Avery and Holcroft?) 'blacked up' in an attempt to escape......

Presumably the tale of Shepstone handing over 'his' horse to a NNMC trooper must have come from somewhere (the NNMC trooper?)......

A Zulu says he killed a British officer writing a final letter (laundry/shopping list) in his tent - this becomes Pulleine......

Additionally from the Zulu side how many 'battlefield myths' were repeated amongst their army becoming 'facts'........the standard bearer trusting others to protect him, the chap in the cave (obviously linked to the British as the skeleton with the halter round his neck - which is more likely to be one of the of the captives?)

Cheers

Sime
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


Posts : 8362
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 75
Location : Cape Town South Africa

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 10:54 am

Hi Sime
Your last paragraph. Mainwaring found the cave with portion of a uniform and a quantity of spent ammunition. He was also the man that found the corpse with the rope around his neck. He said he was quite suprised to see some time later a painting had been done of the cave as he though he and his travelling companion were the only people that knew of it.
And wasnt it Vereker that handed over his horse? There was a witness to that, cant recall who but I will look it up.
The playing cards is just plain stupid. Smith and Pulleine died around 5 kilometers apart, as far as Im aware nobody mentions loud bellows of 'GIN' ringing around the mountains. Very Happy

Cheers Mate
Back to top Go down
SRB1965

SRB1965


Posts : 896
Join date : 2017-05-13
Age : 57
Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 11:47 am

Hi Frank,

Oh yeah it was Vereker who gave his horse, Shepstone was supposedly killed whilst reloading.

The tale of the Last of the 24th was first written in Colenso and Durnfords book about the Zulu War and apparently the Natal Times.

Mainwaring said

I determined one day to explore the Rock for a path leading up to the top…Just as I was ascending a rocky shoulder I came to a small cave. Looking into this I saw the floor strewn with empty cartridge cases, also shreds of a red serge jacket. Evidently some poor 24th man had defended himself and made a last stand here. In searching about 100 yards below I came upon a human skeleton with a rope around the neck.
After fetching our Doctor from the Camp I asked if the remains were those of a white or black man? He replied undoubtedly those of a white man. This incident I believe was known only to the doctor and myself yet strange to say a friend sent me some years after from Dublin a photo of a picture painted by a Dublin Artist entitled ‘The Last of the 24th.’ I have a copy now. But how did this Artist get to know of the subject? The little cave was reproduced exactly as I saw it.


I would say that it would be hard to link a body 100 yards from a cave - with the cave on battlefield full of bodies...

Cheers

Sime
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


Posts : 8362
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 75
Location : Cape Town South Africa

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 12:13 pm

Hi Sime
100 yards below the cave, wherever it is, would possible put that body either on the Younghusband plateau or his line of retreat, not really the battlefield per se. My thoughts of that 'man in a cave' have always centered on his view across the plain watching Chelmsford and hoping he would be rescued. Its unfortunate he wasnt rescued, just think of the tale he could have told. Probably a 100% description of the battle from his aerial viewpoint.
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10613
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 66
Location : Melbourne, Australia

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Strange Tales from Isandlwana    Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 1:33 pm

Hi Sime and Frank
I can recall reading somewhere , can't remember where before you ask !..... that Shepstone was found while trying to hide under a body , or bodies ? , or under cover somewhere , can't remember which one it was to be exact .
90th
Back to top Go down
SRB1965

SRB1965


Posts : 896
Join date : 2017-05-13
Age : 57
Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 3:35 pm

Frank,

I have always said that had Mel & Cog made in another couple of hundred yards, possibly over the hill and to the NNMC (where ever they were - I know they provided some covering fire from the Natal bank for a while) - I would be discussing the Little Big Horn or the Alamo* with someone else......because most of the mysteries of Isandlwana would not be mysteries.....

90th,

Yeah I have read that somewhere, that he was hiding under a body but got discovered - undoubtedly someone was playing possum (probably a 'Pvt Brown' of the ASC) who got busted, and the Chinese Whispers (amongst the Zulus) turned him into GS.....it could have been him of course - there is no reason why GS died as described by the Zulu (shooting all before him until outsmarted by a quick thinking warrior)

Cheers

Sime

* I am on a couple of such forums but the Americans are so excitable about such things.....
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


Posts : 8362
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 75
Location : Cape Town South Africa

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 4:19 pm

Comes back to this:
"We were told that present during the fighting was a son of Somseu, he fought very bravely, he
killed our people, the others feared to approach him, suddenly there dashed our brother Umtweni
before he could load and killed him."
Back to top Go down
SRB1965

SRB1965


Posts : 896
Join date : 2017-05-13
Age : 57
Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 5:21 pm

Like all things.....(sort of like Heisenbergs Theory of Uncertainty) can you monitor something (or this case question someone) without influencing it (them)?

Was Umtweni's brother being questioned by (or for) 'Old Man Shepstone'....? Did Umtwenis brother have some motive or agenda in saying this?

I'm just being pedantic, mate......not got out much lately.....in the last 9 months the furthest I have been from home is 13 miles.....only been out of town once.....and that was to a place called Rugeley....if you'd ever been to Rugeley, you would understand......

Cheers

Sime
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


Posts : 8362
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 75
Location : Cape Town South Africa

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySat Aug 22, 2020 6:45 pm

There was a fairly long interview with Umtweni as a young kid. His most famous phrase was "Dead was everything". He spent time with a couple of days of the battle wandering around the
battlefield
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10613
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 66
Location : Melbourne, Australia

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Strange Tales from Isandlwana    Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Aug 23, 2020 12:19 am

Hi Frank and Sime
Frank you have confused Umtweni with Muziwento , it was the boy Muziwento from memory who coined the phrase ' Dead was everything ' after he'd visited Isandlwana , it was Muziwento , who stated it was Umtweni who dashed in and killed Shepstone as he was reloading , he also says Umtweni was later Killed at Hlobane . I haven't read the link you posted , if in case , you have mentioned of Umtweni's demise ? .
90th
Back to top Go down
Frank Allewell

Frank Allewell


Posts : 8362
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 75
Location : Cape Town South Africa

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Aug 23, 2020 6:51 am

Quite right, bit of a bitch when senility creeps in. Shocked
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10613
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 66
Location : Melbourne, Australia

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Strange Tales from Isandlwana    Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Aug 23, 2020 2:08 pm

Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy . Don't be to hard on yourself Frank , lock down probably isn't helping either !? .
90th Salute Joker
Back to top Go down
SRB1965

SRB1965


Posts : 896
Join date : 2017-05-13
Age : 57
Location : Uttoxeter - the last place God made and he couldn't be bothered to finish it.....

Strange tales from Isandlwana Empty
PostSubject: Re: Strange tales from Isandlwana   Strange tales from Isandlwana EmptySun Aug 23, 2020 4:25 pm

I bet lockdown/Cyril's Prohibition is not helping his wine cellar..... Joker
Back to top Go down
 
Strange tales from Isandlwana
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Edward Fletcher 90th Regiment and his strange premonition Saltmarshe

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM  :: GENERAL DISCUSSION AREA-
Jump to: