Latest topics | » The Pictorial World - March 15th 1879![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Yesterday at 1:13 pm by ben2000 » The lost diary of Pvt James Owen![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 25, 2024 12:03 pm by miklew » Last of the 24th at Isandhlwana![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 24, 2024 6:16 pm by John Young » What was the uniform of field marshals/generals in the zulu war?![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Jul 22, 2024 6:53 am by John Young » Henderson and the NNH at Rorke's Drift ![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Jul 20, 2024 12:17 pm by SRB1965 » Capt. D. Hayes 1/3rd Regt., NNC![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 18, 2024 11:11 am by Julian Whybra » The Wrecked Camp![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 17, 2024 4:33 pm by Julian Whybra » Private N/N John Robert Branch 90th Regiment and his discovered diary![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Jul 15, 2024 8:53 pm by 1879graves » Private John Scott 24th Regiment a fugitive at large![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 12:06 pm by 1879graves » 90th foot sgt T. Collins 214![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 10:57 am by johnman » Baron Von Steitencron![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 10, 2024 3:10 pm by Julian Whybra » Sgt Joseph Windridge, Defender of Rorke's Drift - Memorial![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Jul 09, 2024 3:15 am by 90th » Writing advice![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 07, 2024 4:04 pm by Julian Whybra » South Africa 1877-79, 1 clasp, 1877-8-9 (4389 Fr. Sergt. S. Smith. O/2. Bde. R.A.)![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 07, 2024 9:30 am by rai » The trashing of the Zulu monument to the brave warriors at Isandlawana March 12, 2024 has been blamed on scrap metal scavengers.![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:41 pm by ADMIN» The Goodwill Zulu Festival: Celebrating the Welsh and KwaZulu Natal Shared Heritage.![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:27 pm by ADMIN» Any nominal role of G Coy 2/24th regiment ![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 11:18 am by Wayne » Bassage Diary![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 9:31 am by Julian Whybra » Prior to Sihayo's Kraal ![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 9:19 am by 90th » British Fort Locations![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 3:40 am by 90th » Sergeant 1064 Tom Hick / Hicks G Company 2/24th Regiment![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 03, 2024 11:05 am by Julian Whybra » A Hungarian soldier in the Zulu War (?)![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jun 28, 2024 2:31 pm by Mr M. Cooper » Private 25B/279 Henry Sears Bugler E Company 24th Reg. KIA Isandlwana![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 27, 2024 1:07 pm by gardner1879 » Hamilton Browne's birthday![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jun 21, 2024 9:22 am by Julian Whybra » Zulu "Corps"![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 20, 2024 6:01 pm by Hobbes » Army Pay Department Personnel![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jun 20, 2024 11:49 am by Julian Whybra » Ntshingwayo birth date![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jun 16, 2024 11:37 am by Hobbes » Zibhebhu and Cetshwayo's family![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:11 pm by Julian Whybra » Smith's Store/Hotel![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jun 05, 2024 6:06 pm by Julian Whybra » Corporal James Frowen Williams F Company. ![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Jun 04, 2024 5:20 pm by Julian Whybra » Shaka iLembe![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Jun 01, 2024 1:27 pm by Jon84 » Bugler 1415 Thomas Finn / Flin 90th Regiment ![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat May 25, 2024 11:28 am by johnman » Inspector-General Evelyn Richard Hugh Pollard![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue May 14, 2024 10:13 am by ADMIN» Alfred Fairlie Henderson photographs.![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat May 11, 2024 8:01 am by Julian Whybra » Fairlie's Native Police![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu May 02, 2024 9:12 pm by Hobbes |
July 2024 | Mon | Tue | Wed | Thu | Fri | Sat | Sun |
---|
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | 30 | 31 | | | | | Calendar |
|
Top posting users this month | |
New topics | » The Pictorial World - March 15th 1879![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Yesterday at 1:13 pm by ben2000 » The lost diary of Pvt James Owen![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 25, 2024 12:03 pm by miklew » Last of the 24th at Isandhlwana![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 24, 2024 5:53 pm by miklew » What was the uniform of field marshals/generals in the zulu war?![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 21, 2024 12:30 pm by darthvaix » Henderson and the NNH at Rorke's Drift ![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Jul 19, 2024 1:29 pm by SRB1965 » Capt. D. Hayes 1/3rd Regt., NNC![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Jul 17, 2024 10:52 pm by Julian Whybra » The Wrecked Camp![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Jul 14, 2024 8:51 am by 61MECH » The trashing of the Zulu monument to the brave warriors at Isandlawana March 12, 2024 has been blamed on scrap metal scavengers.![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:41 pm by ADMIN» The Goodwill Zulu Festival: Celebrating the Welsh and KwaZulu Natal Shared Heritage.![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Jul 04, 2024 7:27 pm by ADMIN |
Zero tolerance to harassment and bullying. |
Due to recent events on this forum, we have now imposed a zero tolerance to harassment and bullying. All reports will be treated seriously, and will lead to a permanent ban of both membership and IP address.
Any member blatantly corresponding in a deliberate and provoking manner will be removed from the forum as quickly as possible after the event.
If any members are being harassed behind the scenes PM facility by any member/s here at 1879zuluwar.com please do not hesitate to forward the offending text.
We are all here to communicate and enjoy the various discussions and information on the Anglo Zulu War of 1879. Opinions will vary, you will agree and disagree with one another, we will have debates, and so it goes.
There is no excuse for harassment or bullying of anyone by another person on this site.
The above applies to the main frame areas of the forum.
The ring which is the last section on the forum, is available to those members who wish to partake in slagging matches. That section cannot be viewed by guests and only viewed by members that wish to do so. |
Fair Use Notice | Fair use notice.
This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner.
We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes.
We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website.
If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution. |
| | Younghusbands Retreat | |
|
+18barry 6pdr Younghusband 24th Chelmsfordthescapegoat Mr Greaves John SergioD Ulundi Drummer Boy 14 impi Dave ymob Chard1879 littlehand ADMIN 90th Frank Allewell 22 posters | |
Author | Message |
---|
Younghusband
![Younghusband](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/184-44.gif)
Posts : 60 Join date : 2010-08-17 Location : Southampton
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Fri Jan 10, 2014 11:43 am | |
| Yes, good suggestion - hadn't considered that and would make sense - it was clear that the majority of soldiers felt that their best chance lay in staying and fighting together - Younghusband's remaining few would have seen - more than most in their elevated position - that there was no escape down the hill, through the nek towards fugitives drift as the whole area must have been swarming with Zulu.
What goes through a man's mind at this point God only knows!! |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Fri Jan 10, 2014 12:42 pm | |
| - Younghusband wrote:
What goes through a man's mind at this point God only knows!! A Knobkerrie? |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Guest Guest
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Fri Jan 10, 2014 1:16 pm | |
| with provenance! |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 6pdr
![6pdr](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/908-11.jpg)
Posts : 1086 Join date : 2012-05-12 Location : NYC
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:40 am | |
| The start of this thread was my thoughts on Younghusbands retreat. When I was writing it I looked through all the Zulu statements made and something about the Mehlokazulu report from the the 27th September 1879 seemed odd. A question was put to him: Where there any soldiers in the camp then. They were at this time in the camp having come back from the front, all but two companies, which went onto the hill and never returned-they were every one of them killed. They were firing on the two wings of the Zulu army while the body of the army was pushing on............... This statement has always been seen as referring to Mostyn and Cavaye. I would however contend that it could refer rather to Younghusband and Shepstone taking post on the slopes of iSandlwana, the Hill. In a separate question. Were the bayonets of the two companies who were killed fixed? Yes: The men formed back to back. Some Zulus threw assegais at them others shot at them...........
This second question doesn't refer to the main defenders on the saddle, Mehlokazulu refers to them in a prievious answer so 'the two companies on the hill' has to refer to either two companies climbing Malhabamkosi ( Blacks Kopie ) or iSandlwana. There is no evidence to suggest that any troops climbed the koppie, in fact the left horn charged over and around it.
My contention would be therefore that this statement does confirm the presence of a large number of men on iSandlwana. And would answer the long held confusion over the 'missing companies' debate. It could also shed some light on why the two horns never closed the gap at the rear of the mountain allowing the escape of the fugitives
Just some thoughts. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | barry
![barry](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/695-62.jpg)
Posts : 947 Join date : 2011-10-21 Location : Algoa Bay
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: The missing company Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:23 am | |
| Hi Frank, Indeed, sounds both feasible and plausible. Could very well be the explanation for the "missing company". However one should not put too much into the location of the cairns as to markers where the men actually fell, as human remains were collected up into hessian bags some months post the battle and taken to central collection points. These places were marked with cairns, now white painted.
regards
barry |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:34 am | |
| Morning Barry Couldn't agree more but knowing exactly how economical with energy squaddies the world over are I cant see them carrying heavy bags uphill, more probably downhill. So the cairns on the lower and upper slopes could very possibly be the central areas of collecting. More area indicators than specific locations I would say.
Cheers |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 1879graves
![1879graves](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/15-99.jpg)
Posts : 3379 Join date : 2009-03-03 Location : Devon
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:58 am | |
| 90th View of Younghusbands Retreat from his camera. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Looking back from Main Y'husband Cairn. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]From Y'huband's Cairn to Conical Hill & Ithusi Heights [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]From Y'huband's to the Colonial Cemetery [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]From Y'huband's to Black's Kopie [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Y'husband retreated toward the camera [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Y'husband Retreat path which is toward the camera [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Path of Y'husband retreat toward the camera , Inyoni Ridge background [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Y'husband area [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Y'husband area [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]from Y'husband to the ' Cave ' [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Down the path from Y'husbands [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Down the path from Y'husbands , right of previous pic [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Looking back to Y'husbands Cairns Camera change coming up |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 1879graves
![1879graves](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/15-99.jpg)
Posts : 3379 Join date : 2009-03-03 Location : Devon
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Sun Sep 13, 2015 11:19 am | |
| |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | rusteze
![rusteze](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/134-77.png)
Posts : 2871 Join date : 2010-06-02
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Sun Sep 13, 2015 1:14 pm | |
| Gary. Excellent! Graves. Thanks very much.
Steve |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 90th
![90th](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/22-38.jpg)
Posts : 10890 Join date : 2009-04-07 Age : 68 Location : Melbourne, Australia
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Younghusband's Retreat Sun Sep 13, 2015 1:35 pm | |
| Thanks for the compliment Steve Graves Thanks mate for posting the pics , as always very much appreciated Cheers 90th |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Sun Sep 13, 2015 3:12 pm | |
| Well done Gary so glad to see you didn't spend all your time in the bar. ![Very Happy](https://2img.net/i/fa/i/smiles/icon_biggrin.png) Great photos |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 90th
![90th](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/22-38.jpg)
Posts : 10890 Join date : 2009-04-07 Age : 68 Location : Melbourne, Australia
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Younghusband's Retreat Sun Sep 13, 2015 11:19 pm | |
| |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | 90th
![90th](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/22-38.jpg)
Posts : 10890 Join date : 2009-04-07 Age : 68 Location : Melbourne, Australia
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | waterloo50
![waterloo50](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/1473-92.jpg)
Posts : 600 Join date : 2013-09-18 Location : West Country
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Mon Sep 14, 2015 4:22 pm | |
| I appreciate that there have been many arguments made both for and against the possibility of Younghusband making a charge through a heavily bouldered area but my own thoughts are that Younghusband probably didn't have time to think about what was under his feet. I believe he would have been more concerned about what was ahead and to the sides of him, from the reports that we have, he was surrounded, he was being attacked on all sides. My interpretation is that he did run possibly waving his sword above his head (its was his way of saying, get back, stay away from me) he probably lashed out at anything that he perceived as a threat. To the onlooker this would have appeared as a charge but to my mind it was nothing more complicated or desperate than a man fighting/running for his life. It makes sense to me that he would try to head back to the main body of the 24th 'safety in numbers'. In a nutshell, Younghusband led a charge of sorts but not in the sense that we would understand, it was more likely to be an everyman for himself situation. That would at least explain the shaking of the hands, a ' I will see you chaps down there', kind of thing.
nje umbono wami |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Ray63
![Ray63](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/899-82.jpg)
Posts : 705 Join date : 2012-05-05
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:50 pm | |
| Essex say's the men didn't have time to fix bayonets?
Is there any reason why Bayonets weren't fixed when it became obvious, that the camp was going to be attacked. " If the last order heard was "Fix bayonets, and died like British soldiers do" then there must have been a reason why they waited until the end was near before doing so. I take it a MH Rifle is able to fire, with a bayonet fixed ?
Was Younghusband and his men forced into a wagon park? |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | waterloo50
![waterloo50](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/1473-92.jpg)
Posts : 600 Join date : 2013-09-18 Location : West Country
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Tue Sep 15, 2015 12:30 pm | |
| Ray63
I don't think that it was immediately obvious that the camp was going to be over-run. In Zulu Rising, Ian knight states, 'Brickhill observed that the battle 'was about to roll up and engulf the tents.' he then goes onto say, ' Essex saw the 24th officers struggling to keep their men under control; the men became unsteady. A few fixed bayonettes.'- Lieutenant Stafford of the 1st NNC heard one officer calling on his men to 'Fix Bayonettes'.'
The Martini Henry can be fired with a bayonet attached but I'm not sure if the additional weight has an effect on accuracy. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Younghusbands Retreat - Page 3 Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Younghusbands Retreat Tue Sep 15, 2015 5:57 pm | |
| The Zulus had a great respect for the bayonet, there are a couple of references to it being used. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | | Younghusbands Retreat | |
|
Similar topics | ![+](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) |
|
| Permissions in this forum: | You cannot reply to topics in this forum
| |
| |
| |